How long is it reasonable to watch a bunny with bellyache before taking them to vet?

I should have enough experience on this but I doubt myself because it's out of hours and I think Pet Plan might think I'm taking the Mick It will cost a minimum of £104 for him to be seen and given appropriate meds.

Elijah has bellyache, I've been out at work between 3pm and 7.15pm and when I got in he was laid in his litter tray looking sorry for himself. He's intermittantly breathing fast (but not really badly so), and I can hear gurgling. I can't say whether he's pooped since I've been out but he wouldn't normally anyway, he often pops a big pile out during the evening.

If I knew the exact time of onset it would make the decision easier. He's looking miserable rather than distressed. I know all the chase him about, tempt him with food etc and I should have the courage to do a blood glucose test, but I don't - regardless of what it says anyway he's in pain and refusing food, so he needs pain and gut meds whatever that reads.

I was thinking of giving it to 8.30 / 9.00 if there's no change - does that sound reasonable? I know this also depends on the rabbit and whether this is a regular occurence - it is fairly frequent but I don't know if that means I take him sooner or later :?

(vibes also welcomed)

I personally would take him now. The sooner he is seen the faster he can be treated and start feeling better. Julie went into Gi stasis once. I took her at the first refusal of food as I know she never refuses food.
I would offer him a treat that he never refuses and if he does refuse then I'd take him in as soon as possible.......especially if you think that he is in pain.

bunnytoes said:

I personally would take him now. The sooner he is seen the faster he can be treated and start feeling better. Julie went into Gi stasis once. I took her at the first refusal of food as I know she never refuses food.
I would offer him a treat that he never refuses and if he does refuse then I'd take him in as soon as possible.......especially if you think that he is in pain.

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Thanks. When I arrived home I had a Fenugreek Crunchie in my hand and he turned away from it. I could see as soon as I entered the room that he was 'off it'. I normally do take them pretty much immediately especially if it's during normal surgery hours. This is the 10th episode he's had, quite a few have been at this time of day. It might just been that he needs to break wind and he will feel better ... he might need the meds to make him do that. I can't bear to see him looking so unhappy but I have to question whether I'm over-reacting.

Hiya :wave:
What normally happens when he's like this? Does he generally get over it himself pretty quick or do you get meds for him? I have a bunny called Daisy who is like that quite often, the first few times i rushed her to the vet in a panic, but all they gave her was metacam, which i could give her myself at home if needs be. What i do now is keep trying to tempt her to eat, sometimes she will refuse everything for a while, then suddenly take a few strands of hay from me. Keep offering him fresh hay and anything else that he really likes. I always stroke them a lot too, especially their tummy if they'll let you. That seems to help a lot. Do you have any metacam? I hope Elijah feels better soon, tons of vibes for him from me. I would give him until about 9ish before calling the vet, unless he seems to be really bad. xx

By the way. the fact you can hear gurgling is good as it means everything is still moving :wave:

Bunny Buddy said:

Thanks. When I arrived home I had a Fenugreek Crunchie in my hand and he turned away from it. I could see as soon as I entered the room that he was 'off it'. I normally do take them pretty much immediately especially if it's during normal surgery hours. This is the 10th episode he's had, quite a few have been at this time of day. It might just been that he needs to break wind and he will feel better ... he might need the meds to make him do that. I can't bear to see him looking so unhappy but I have to question whether I'm over-reacting.

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Oh...I see. I only have experience with the one GI stasis episode ....knock on wood...........I know nothing about gas. I would just take him because I don't know anything but hopefully someone who is more savvy on this sort of thing will come by. 10 times is a lot. I'd of riped my hair out by now.

ripminnie said:

Hiya :wave:
What normally happens when he's like this? Does he generally get over it himself pretty quick or do you get meds for him? I have a bunny called Daisy who is like that quite often, the first few times i rushed her to the vet in a panic, but all they gave her was metacam, which i could give her myself at home if needs be. What i do now is keep trying to tempt her to eat, sometimes she will refuse everything for a while, then suddenly take a few strands of hay from me. Keep offering him fresh hay and anything else that he really likes. I always stroke them a lot too, especially their tummy if they'll let you. That seems to help a lot. Do you have any metacam? I hope Elijah feels better soon, tons of vibes for him from me. I would give him until about 9ish before calling the vet, unless he seems to be really bad. xx

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Thanks. I haven't often left it long to be honest as I just can't bear to watch him in pain and our usual vet is 45 minutes away. The vet I need to use tonight is only 10 minutes away which makes me feel I can leave it a bit longer before deciding.

I can tell from his demeanour and facial expression that he won't take any food from me. He had a very expressive face and does the 'man flu' thing - when he's out of sorts you can't not notice. I've been making a fuss of him, which he appreciates, I've also just made him do a couple of laps which he didn't appreciate. He will need meds if he doesn't suddenly flick out of it bur he has had some very high blood glucose readings which makes me reluctant to give meds without a vet having examined him first.

bunnytoes said:

Oh...I see. I only have experience with the one GI stasis episode ....knock on wood...........I know nothing about gas. I would just take him because I don't know anything but hopefully someone who is more savvy on this sort of thing will come by. 10 times is a lot. I'd of riped my hair out by now.

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Thanks for your input anyway. That's actually why I'm questioning if I'm taking him too soon as *maybe* I should leave him longer knowing he has a propensity to it. Thinking about it, he's had more than 10 episodes - he's see a vet 10 times for it and there's a few times he's been like this for 20 minutes or so and then been bright again.

I've rung the vet as he's been like this at least 1.5 hours, maybe as long as 5 hours, so if he was going to get better on his own he probably would have by now. Vet will be ringing back soon (spoke to duty nurse who then rings vet).

many vibes

I'm too late to be useful now, but when this happens to Truffle I usually give her at least an hour and just sit and watch her the whole time. If she doesn't seem to be getting worse, I'd maybe give her another half hour or so. More often than not, the car journey to the vets seems to sort her out anyway!

Not sure what I'd do if I came home and found her like that though - possibly still watch her for an hour of so unless she seemed to be in severe discomfort (just one time she progressed from flopping around with her belly on the floor to hunched up tooth-grinding - would have her straight to the vets if she was like that).

mini lop1 said:

many vibes

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Thank you.

esupi said:

I'm too late to be useful now, but when this happens to Truffle I usually give her at least an hour and just sit and watch her the whole time. If she doesn't seem to be getting worse, I'd maybe give her another half hour or so. More often than not, the car journey to the vets seems to sort her out anyway!

Not sure what I'd do if I came home and found her like that though - possibly still watch her for an hour of so unless she seemed to be in severe discomfort (just one time she progressed from flopping around with her belly on the floor to hunched up tooth-grinding - would have her straight to the vets if she was like that).

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Thanks, it's actually not too late but really helpful. It's given me reassurance, that's pretty much how I play it too, and yes, I've had the "eating and bright as soon as they get home" and wondered if it's the meds or the car journey!

Anyhow, no way could Pet Plan or vet question whether it was necessary to do the emergency call out as his blood glucose reading was 16.5 This is not actually very uncommon for Elijah when he has these symptoms. There was nothing to find on examination, temp slightly below normal but everything else (thorough check) fine. He's had Metcam, Domperidone, I lost the use of my ears and brain when he said 16.5 but he talked about Buprenorphine and Zantac so he's probably had the too. I'll watch and if I'm worried I will try really hard to repeat the blood glucose test as I should be able to find the vein very easily. Hopefully though he'll be much brigher soon.

Edit to add: I can't find the Fenugreek Crunchie that I tried to give him when I got home from work and some carrot tops have DEFINITELY been eaten and, really, really, cute, Erin who is 'bonded to him but lives next to him' (long story) didn't eat her tea whilst we were out but she's started tucking in now

Everything crossed here for him.

You're far more experienced in this than I am - I have no idea about blood glucose tests or any of that - just have to follow my gut. The first few times it happened we were at the vets straight away, but then you get to know them and how things are with them and learn to make a judgement. I always think it must be very like having a new baby (not that I ever plan to find out!)

esupi said:

Everything crossed here for him.

You're far more experienced in this than I am - I have no idea about blood glucose tests or any of that - just have to follow my gut. The first few times it happened we were at the vets straight away, but then you get to know them and how things are with them and learn to make a judgement. I always think it must be very like having a new baby (not that I ever plan to find out!)

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**shudders** :lol::lol:

Re Blood glucose testing - I've never actually managed to take one I've been shown how but I just can't stick the needle in and it's beyond me why, I don't think I'm squeemish about blood, no do I think it will hurt, anyhow, I doubt it will be necessary tonight as he looks much better already.

Better go find some raspberry leaves now.

Glad he is perking up already!

Glad he's feeling a bit better now! Xx :wave:

Just seen this Bunny Buddy. How is he now?
I find that shining a torch through the back of the ear shows up the vein.
Be tough, it is only a momentary ***** they feel. Then sqeeze as if you were pushing out a thorn with both thumb nails, you only need the tiniest dot of blood to use.
Though I do shake every time I do it and some time miss the vein, but it is worth doing.

At 16, no wonder you were in a panic.
I have had buns that looked in serious pain but readings were only slightly elevated and they began to recover , after metacam and infacol,after a few hours. (somtimes less time) any longer than this then I would have had them to the vet as I think they are needing fluids by then.
I hope he is improving now.

So glad he is feeling better.

Thanks everybody.

rabbitapril said:

How is he now?

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It was a temporary feeling of relief for me as he just looks out of it now, but I'm not panicking about that as I'm assuming its the morphine-based painkiller, he doesn't seem in pain anymore but just not very interested in anything. He has grass, raspberry leaves, carrot tops but hasn't eaten any more and runs away if I go to fuss him, tempt him to food. I'm going to let him be for a while.

I've just remember, of course, that you saw him last time he was feeling rough! That day was a '15' if I remember correctly. I was just checking everybody before I left the house to collect Erin by appointment and he was in bellyache mode so no assessing that day, just shoved the poor boy in a carrier!

It's looking more like I might have to do another blood glucose,even if just for reassurance, so thanks for the encouragement/pointers, I'm sure that his current presentation is the drugs though, not illness.

Try not to panic. I think its been assesed that it is not a blockage now.
Just because he has recoverd from this many times before does not garantee that he will recover this time.
But the chances he will , and are pretty high.
I am still undecided if the opium pain killer (cant remember the name) is a good thing or not. There seem to be arguments for and against it.
I am quite rubbish at giving advice, but I do send best wishes. And I do rememer that day clearly when you took one away and left another.
When this has happend to me in the past, I have wonderd 'have i got a vet fettish' . 'Am I not happy unless I have a bunny at the vet'!!
But the truth is the more buns we have, the more often we are at the vet.
And some bunnies just need to be at the vets more often than others