Enlarged heart. Advice please. Anyone used Vetmedin?

Sadly, last week my bunny, Uncle, was diagnosed with an enlarged heart.
He is on frusemide but on a check up on Tuesday I was given Vetmedin for him.
Heart problems is a new experience for me, any advice would be welcome. thanks.

Hi there, sorry to hear that your bunny has heart problems, this seems to be more common in certain breeds as well. I have never experienced this with rabbits but several members on here have lots of experience. I do know that an enlarged heart causes cardiac insufficiency simply because of the inability to pump blood smoothly and regularly as it is under extra strain, so there is often back pressure and excess fluid pooling - which is why frusemide as a diuretic will help shift the extra blood volume.

Because of the extra work and effort of the heart bunny will tire and struggle to oxygenate the blood so efficiently so there may be breathing difficulties as well.

I hope that the drugs make your bunny more comfortable for his remaining time with you x

Sorry I dont have time to post a lengthy reply

These links may be useful to read

http://wildpro.twycrosszoo.org/S/00dis/Miscellaneous/CongestiveHeartFailureRabbit.htm

http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Cardiology/Failure/congestive.htm

http://www.lagomorphs.com/heart.pdf

https://www.bsava.com/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=0xF1qUK3bkw=&tabid=955&mid=2395

*WARNING-GRAPHIC IMAGES IN THE FOLLOWING LINK*

http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Cardiology/Cardio/Cardio_en.htm

Thanks for your replies Prettylupin and Jacksjane.

He is fairly stable at the moment and his breathing has improved with a slightly bigger dose of frusemide.

My vet has not used Vetmedin on a rabbit before but said she has heard or others using it without a problem. I have not actually given him any yet as i wanted to know more about it.:?
His heart is three quarters bigger than it should be which sounds horrendous.
He still has a good appitite though
I am so worried about him

Some threads on here :

http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/s...etmedin-alongside-fortekor&highlight=vetmedin

http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/s...nnies-with-heart-problems.&highlight=vetmedin

http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/s...die-and-his-new-Medication&highlight=vetmedin

http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/s...ce-wanted-heart-failure-(.&highlight=vetmedin

http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/s....-June-2007-8th-April-2010&highlight=vetmedin

http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/s...ac-problems-U-D-Good-news!&highlight=vetmedin

BB is on Enacard and Frusemide. She was on Fortekor, but as it stinks of liver I asked the vet for an alternative, and Enacard is the one used by all the heart bunnies in the sanctuary.

The Frusemide gives quite a quick result - BB looked more comfortable within a few hours of taking it, as it gets rid of all the back up of fluid.
Make sure Uncle has access to plenty of extra water as it does tend to make them thirsty, and BB now does the hugest wees I've ever seen!!

BB has been on her meds just over three weeks and she is a lot more comfortable than she was. I can tell when she's having problems because she finds somewhere to sit where she can put her bum on the floor, and her front paws resting on something 5 or 6 inches higher to either relieve the pressure, or to enable her to breathe easier.

They are on borrowed time once their on heart meds, but the drug therapy makes them so much more comfortable, and we have many in the sanctuary that have continued to have a good life on meds.

No advice just wanted to say

So sorry Uncle has even more to deal with. Artie has been on Frusemide for 3 years now to assist with his bladder sludge so at least it won't be something bad for Uncle to be on in that regard. As above post, Artie drinks and wees a huge amount. (He's on 1/2 tablet daily).

I hope he does well on his medicine regime and the great care he's getting.

BB MOMMY
Uncle found a cusion in my dogs bed that he lies over, in a strange way, then hangs over to eat, similar to what you mention. He hasn't done this as much since starting fruesimide though.

I appreciate you sharing your experiences.

Best wishes to BB.

Bunny Buddy said:

No advice just wanted to say

So sorry Uncle has even more to deal with. Artie has been on Frusemide for 3 years now to assist with his bladder sludge so at least it won't be something bad for Uncle to be on in that regard. As above post, Artie drinks and wees a huge amount. (He's on 1/2 tablet daily).

I hope he does well on his medicine regime and the great care he's getting.

Click to expand...

I wonder why FHB never put Uncle on frusemide:? The problem must be different to your Arties'.
I do think it may be helping his bladder slightly.

But to complicate things he is a dental bun. He had a spur on his tooth when I took him on tuesday.
He sat so good wrapped in a towel while she tried to guage where the spur was and rasp the point off it:shock:

It seems to have worked though as he looks more comfortable eating.
I am glad she tried to do this as he is now at high risk or dying under a GA.

rabbitapril said:

I wonder why FHB never put Uncle on frusemide:? The problem must be different to your Arties'.
I do think it may be helping his bladder slightly.

But to complicate things he is a dental bun. He had a spur on his tooth when I took him on tuesday.
He sat so good wrapped in a towel while she tried to guage where the spur was and rasp the point off it:shock:

It seems to have worked though as he looks more comfortable eating.
I am glad she tried to do this as he is now at high risk or dying under a GA.

Click to expand...

I've wondered in the past why Uncle has different treatment for the same condition, the only thing I can come up with is that F believes that Artie doesn't fully empty his bladder, therefore the sludge builds up. I'm guessing that she thinks there's a different cause for Uncle's problem therefore the treatment isn't the same. She's been really pleased with Artie's bladder the last 3 times we've been - it looks more like wee than cold tea at the moment :mrgreen:

So glad the conscious dental went well, it would be very hard to manage his problem now if that wasn't so easily done.

Bunny Buddy said:

I've wondered in the past why Uncle has different treatment for the same condition, the only thing I can come up with is that F believes that Artie doesn't fully empty his bladder, therefore the sludge builds up. I'm guessing that she thinks there's a different cause for Uncle's problem therefore the treatment isn't the same. She's been really pleased with Artie's bladder the last 3 times we've been - it looks more like wee than cold tea at the moment :mrgreen:

So glad the conscious dental went well, it would be very hard to manage his problem now if that wasn't so easily done.

Click to expand...

Uncle can only pass a few drops of urine at a time and needs a GA to have his bladder emptied, Fhb thinks he may have a kink in the tube (cant think of proper word). She thinks his bladder is/has been so streched he does not realy get the sensation he needs to wee.
She also says it could be due to EC, which is likley with his heart problem now.

I am glad arties bladder has been good recently.
(I dont suppose that was you at fhb Tuesday morning two weeks ago? She mentioned that the bunny before me had come in for his bladder to be emptied but he was ok, she also mentioned he only had one kidney.)

rabbitapril said:

Uncle can only pass a few drops of urine at a time and needs a GA to have his bladder emptied, Fhb thinks he may have a kink in the tube (cant think of proper word). She thinks his bladder is/has been so streched he does not realy get the sensation he needs to wee.
She also says it could be due to EC, which is likley with his heart problem now.

I am glad arties bladder has been good recently.
(I dont suppose that was you at fhb Tuesday morning two weeks ago? She mentioned that the bunny before me had come in for his bladder to be emptied but he was ok, she also mentioned he only had one kidney.)

Click to expand...

Oh, poor Uncle that sounds pretty horrible, no wonder the sludge builds up though as it must be difficult for him to empty fully also. I'm lucky that Artie doesn't need a GA, and he's very good bless him. He didn't even thump last time he was there :lol:

We were last there on Tuesday 8th at 11.30. So far as I know Artie is the only bunny being treated there that has had both kidney stones and bladder sludge so it sounds as if it could be us :? Last time we were there we were in about 10 - 15 minutes late, a lady before use came out and waited whilst Artie went in then went back in for her bunny, I guess was being x-rayed or something such. I *think* I was blocked in when I got to the car park so had to ask someone to move. I can't remember if anybody else was in waiting room.

I was that person:wave: who went back to sit in the waiting room whilst she did a concious x-ray on Uncle, that was when his heart problem was discovered. You went in after me while I waited.
I remember seeing a lady sitting with her hand in the pet carrier comfoting her bunny. But she looked close to tears so i did not want to start a conversation. Well fancy that, our paths crossed without us knowing:lol:

rabbitapril said:

I was that person:wave: who went back to sit in the waiting room whilst she did a concious x-ray on Uncle, that was when his heart problem was discovered. You went in after me while I waited.
I remember seeing a lady sitting with her hand in the pet carrier comfoting her bunny. But she looked close to tears so i did not want to start a conversation. Well fancy that, our paths crossed without us knowing:lol:

Click to expand...

:lol::lol::lol: Ain't that funny! It never occurred to me that she was you. I was feeling I knew what you were going through as it was obvious your bunny was having diagnostics which is always scary... your news was definitely scary. I was comforting Artie because the little love sat with his back to me the whole time in the waiting room - he never does that, he always faces me. He'd put up a real battle at being shoved in the carrier as well, so I felt really guilt about that. Do you tell Frances that you talk to other bunny-obsessed people on forums the Internet? She might sometimes put 2 and 2 together and realise people are likely to 'know' each other. I've often referred to information I've read on here/HH re symptoms/ treatments, such as discussing the new vaccine etc.

My last bunny had an enlarged heart, you can read about her here. We used Vetmedin alongside Furosemide and Enalapril. My vet spoke to the Royal D!ck vet about the Vetmedin before using it as he had never used it and they said it was fine. We found it great, it helped quite a bit although Oidhche absolutely hated the taste of it. It took a few weeks for it to properly make a difference though so you do have to be patient.

rabbitapril said:

BB MOMMY
Uncle found a cusion in my dogs bed that he lies over, in a strange way, then hangs over to eat, similar to what you mention. He hasn't done this as much since starting fruesimide though.

Click to expand...

That's a positive, it means the furosemide is working. My heart bun used to sit with her paws up on the litter tray, or even just sitting with her head stretched up in an attempt to get more air in I found a cool room with plenty of air circulation helped a little, as did the herb chamomile, which we gave to her in cooled tea form. This was a tip I got from another member who also had a heart bun.

Lots of vibes to Uncle, and also to BB.