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View Full Version : Pets at home recomend two bucks.



taylor v 109
05-01-2012, 05:01 PM
Over the last couple of weeks i have taken in three pairs of male rabbits that werent getting on. When they came in all needed vet treatment for wounds. All these were sold from Pets at home who say they are fine together. Today i had a call from a lady who was going to pick up two males recomended by pets at home.. She had been told they were ok but she thankfully rang me to check first. I rung them and asked why they were telling their stores to say 2 males are ok and the fact that i was taking them in because they werent. She said they can live together and they advised nutering. They had been advised to home in twos and there was nothing wrong with 2 males.I admit in the end to loosing my temper with her as im sick to death of their bad advise, rescues are picking up the pieces. Perhaps someone has the energy to perhaps take this further say with one of the bigger rabbit organisnations, ive had enough of bashing my head up against a brick wall. :cry:

susie bun
05-01-2012, 05:42 PM
It must be so frustrating for you. :( I know that as a rescue you probably aren't in favour of Pets at Home selling rabbits at all, but in the short-term what would you like to see happen? Two rabbits bought but kept apart until after neutering?

happysaz133
05-01-2012, 06:22 PM
I don't see anything wrong with that, 2 bucks can often live very happily together.

elaine
05-01-2012, 07:42 PM
what pets at home do is sell two males and when they get to 12-16 wks old they start fighting, and then P&H are not interested the only way 2 males will live together is they have to be early neuter no later than 12 wks or they will fight. Even 2 females will have a go unless neutered for any pair to live together they have to be neutered and this is something that all pet shop don't bother to tell people and then rescues are left to pick up the pieces

Lucy1666
05-01-2012, 08:37 PM
Pet shops are pet shops and its all for the profit in the end :(

parsnipbun
05-01-2012, 09:11 PM
what pets at home do is sell two males and when they get to 12-16 wks old they start fighting, and then P&H are not interested the only way 2 males will live together is they have to be early neuter no later than 12 wks or they will fight. Even 2 females will have a go unless neutered for any pair to live together they have to be neutered and this is something that all pet shop don't bother to tell people and then rescues are left to pick up the pieces

Although i agree that many males will fight that is also true of females - so really unless P@H only sell buns once spayed, or singly, or with a legal agreement to neuter once they hit puberty, then selling in pairs is going to always end up in either fights or babies:(. Its a really tricky one - should we go back to suggesting they sell in singles?

Some males do get on after the 12 week 'barrier' if not neutered, though it is very risky.

However, just to clarify, they can be re-introduced to other males at any age once they are neutered. And I have an unneutered male living with neutered male happily - though he is a bit odd.

Kittykat23uk
06-01-2012, 09:07 AM
I agree. I had two males from the same litter, not PAH, from an unwanted litter, and we neutered them together as soon as their plums dropped and they got on fine. No fights at all. But that relies on the new owner getting the right advice and acting on it in good time. I guess it is tempting for some to risk it and "see how they get on" rather than fork out on costly neuters. I also suppose that other small animals that are rehomed as pairs do not have to be neutered to get on? I recall having pairs of guineas (mother and daughter) and gerbils (two males) that were not neutered and they got on well.

taylor v 109
06-01-2012, 11:00 AM
what pets at home do is sell two males and when they get to 12-16 wks old they start fighting, and then P&H are not interested the only way 2 males will live together is they have to be early neuter no later than 12 wks or they will fight. Even 2 females will have a go unless neutered for any pair to live together they have to be neutered and this is something that all pet shop don't bother to tell people and then rescues are left to pick up the pieces

I agree youve saidit. As a rescue i always like to play safe and pair one male one female as its the best pairing. Two females from the same litter spayed at the right time is ok but as a rule i find its best not to say males at all. I know somtimes it works but i would hate to give someone a problem so play it safe.Male female pairing works so well why take a risk that males will inflict wounds on each other.

abbymarysmokey
06-01-2012, 11:23 AM
Our Pets at Home sell bucks in pairs too. They do recommend that the new owners get them neutered, but a lot of people wait until the rabbits have actually started fighting before bothering to talk to the vet about it.

My vets have recently had quite a few cases of bucks being sold in pairs and going on to do serious damage to each other. One case involved emergency surgery to recontruct a penis...which the owner couldn't pay for...my lovely vet did the surgery anyway, and rehomed the rabbit to one of the vet nurses :love:

Santa
06-01-2012, 11:49 AM
It's a tricky one isn't it, and it's a failing of the pet shop system rather than just pets at home themselves. Assuming that we can't stop the pet shop from selling rabbits or force them to neuter them before hand, its options are:

1) They only recommend single rabbits...not good for the rabbits in the long term
2) They only recommend mixed sex pairs as the best long term option...but you can bet your bottom dollar most people won't get them neutered on time (if at all) or will let the buns have "just one litter", not realising that the male will get the female pregnant again right away...
3) They only recommend two females, which probably has more of a chance of staying stable-ish in the longer term even if left unneutered than two males. But then if they only recommend females...what happens to all the males? Will the breeders simply cull the boy babies because the pet shops only demand females?
4) They recommend two males, who, like the two females, could potentially live happily together so long as they are neutered quickly...but will cause massive problems, pain, injury and possibly death if they do not.

In any case, any system which sells unneutered rabbits is 100% reliant on those new owners doing the right thing at the right time and getting those bunnies neutered...which as we know from experience, many won't.

parsnipbun
06-01-2012, 11:58 AM
It's a tricky one isn't it, and it's a failing of the pet shop system rather than just pets at home themselves. Assuming that we can't stop the pet shop from selling rabbits or force them to neuter them before hand, its options are:

1) They only recommend single rabbits...not good for the rabbits in the long term
2) They only recommend mixed sex pairs as the best long term option...but you can bet your bottom dollar most people won't get them neutered on time (if at all) or will let the buns have "just one litter", not realising that the male will get the female pregnant again right away...
3) They only recommend two females, which probably has more of a chance of staying stable-ish in the longer term even if left unneutered than two males. But then if they only recommend females...what happens to all the males? Will the breeders simply cull the boy babies because the pet shops only demand females?
4) They recommend two males, who, like the two females, could potentially live happily together so long as they are neutered quickly...but will cause massive problems, pain, injury and possibly death if they do not.

In any case, any system which sells unneutered rabbits is 100% reliant on those new owners doing the right thing at the right time and getting those bunnies neutered...which as we know from experience, many won't.

summed up excellently!

RedFraggle
06-01-2012, 06:38 PM
They also don't know how to shut their pens. DH found a bunny had pushed open the door they had left open and was hopping round his feet today!

helgalush
06-01-2012, 06:52 PM
Agree with Santa.

susie bun
06-01-2012, 06:57 PM
Agree with Santa.

But this a summing up of options, not a recommendation. I guess the implication of Santa's post is that there is no answer?

SamanthaJane
06-01-2012, 06:59 PM
As Santa says - it's pet shops in general - they aren't the only ones, but are the best known.

Pet shops should neuter/spay before sale - this would prevent these problems and also prevent all the 'accidental' litters and 'we didn't knows'.

But them rabbits would cost a lot more and people would find other ways to get them.

But - I don't know if this is how it works - but if a person is spaying/neutering a lot of rabbits dedicatedly - would the cost come down?

ie- do our vets over charge us a lot because they are small, but somewhere like P@H could afford neutering a lot cheaper?

Kittykat23uk
06-01-2012, 07:01 PM
I think under the circumstances, pet shops would do well to:
probably only sell single rabbits.
give clear advice that rabbits should be neutered and at what age this should be done (they could even sell a neuter/vacc package with the rabbit in the case of PAH since many have vets on site) and that
once neutered, should be found a suitable friend, ideally of the opposite sex and if they are ethical, to recommend that the friend either be housed separately until the second one is neutered or
advise that the new owner should look to adopt a second bun from a rescue.

Totally pie in the sky of course but never mind. :roll:

ETA: in answer to the above post, I think a lot of people go to pet shops rather than rescues because they want a baby rabbit. Who would be too young to neuter. There is something wonderful about seeing a young rabbit grow up, but of course adopting an adult neutered pair has a lot of advantages.

helgalush
06-01-2012, 07:15 PM
But this a summing up of options, not a recommendation. I guess the implication of Santa's post is that there is no answer?

I know, couldnt get my thoughts together to say anything else! :lol: I dont think there is a solution unless the pet shops stop selling rabbits, or sell only neutered rabbits, or offer some kind of discounted neutering scheme. But I cant imagine any of those being likely to happen.

Santa
06-01-2012, 07:22 PM
I know, couldnt get my thoughts together to say anything else! :lol: I dont think there is a solution unless the pet shops stop selling rabbits, or sell only neutered rabbits, or offer some kind of discounted neutering scheme. But I cant imagine any of those being likely to happen.

Exactly!

If pet shops only sold singles, we'd all be complaining that pet shops are sending the wrong message and condemning rabbits to a life of solitude
If they sold mixed sex pairs with neutering advice, we'd be complaining that they're irresponsible and leading to excess accidental breeding
If they only advised selling single sex pairs, well we can see from this thread what we complain about.

There is no solution as long as pet shops sell unneutered pets!