Update agonising decision re tooth root abscess--they went peacefully nose to nose
Thank you all so much --Debster, Kermit, Sky-O, Bunnylover 177,, Mighty Max, Ninny 40 and all on this wonderful forum for the wonderful support and the very helpful and detailed information, which I have kept to share with others. I hope the below may be of some help to others.
I will tell you all more at the end of this post but I’m afraid it may make you cry so maybe skip the end of this post unless you need to know details of euthanasia.
The short update is that a week ago both Rose and Bandit were put to sleep side by side, nose to nose, and as painlessly as anything like this can be. Since we made the decision I have been in bits and couldn’t bring myself to do anything except care for the bunnies in their last days. Yesterday I went onto this site for the first time I felt I could cope to do so.
I want to say thank you so much kind bunny friends for all the replies and sorry not to have got back sooner with news. Bandit and Rose are safe from pain now and I think it was the right decision for them, but absolutely awful for me. We have to be brave enough to do the right thing.
The health details: We saw 2 vets, both rabbit savvy—both of the opinion that Rose was beyond anything but palliative care. Rose’s teeth appeared good to the vet using otoscope. We ruled out an xray under GA.I brought a printout of the Bicillin reference. My vet knew about the subject and had had been on recent training seminars with Sharon Robrobe--- We felt that without invasive treatment-- eg extracting the teeth which had very tangled extended roots, the abscess, even if drained or treated with pennicillin type injection, would have just filled up again.
My OH had to go away for a fortnight and left the bunnies in my care. This was difficult. The 2nd day after the vet saw her Rose came out at breakfast time lively and interested in grazing. Bandit was very attentive. I did not notice immediately that the abscess had burst**************
Skip to next para if you don’t have a strong stomach… Clearly the pressure of the abscess had given her discomfort despite the increased Metacam--because she was so markedly perky after it had drained a little. Bandit the sweetheart had cleaned it all up overnight—not a nice job. The hair around the drain hole had dropped out leaving a pink area and the hole had plugged up again. Rose had a sticky bottom -- I didn’t want to mess her about unnecessarily, but there were a lot of flies. I decided to clean her bottom, and at the same decided to gently open the plug – it didn’t hurt her—but the pus absolutely gushed out—it was very liquid—not like the toothpaste consistency I once had to deal with with a previous tooth root bunny (also eventually PTS I’m afraid) Even though I cleaned the fur around it, flies kept buzzing up—I sat with the buns out in their run and made sure the flies couldn’t settle. ***************
For anyone in this situation, it definitely relieved Rose for the pressure to be lessened—however this bought a short respite only-- it did keep filling up. (The vet said Bandit’s stomach would be able to kill off bacteria he swallowed in grooming it. He showed no ill effects over the next few days.) I hope allowing it to burst naturally and not be painfully lanced was the right decision on my part. It also made me realise how easy it is to misread the signs of illness—Rose had become more quiet but I thought it was arthritis and simply increased her Metacam. I now believe that the tooth roots had been overgrowing for many months or even years. I had felt a hard area under Rose’s jaw many months earlier and thought to myself and even mentioned it to the vet ‘query tooth roots’--but Rose appeared well always enjoyed her food and our attention was on Bandit ‘s corneal ulcers and somehow—amazingly-- I forgot completely about this. I don’t think even at that early stage we would have countenanced invasive difficult surgery and in-patient treatment-- which seems so barbaric for rabbits--especially outdoor bunnies—all the stress of a totally alien environment, smells, temperature, other patients--predator animals.
So it is an unanswered question if we could have treated it earlier.
Like others on this site I felt terrible for not noticing the abscess until it was huge—she had a shaggy moult going on, but I now know that abscesses can blow up very quickly.
The dilemma was that both bunnies were actively Ec and so bonding with another would have been problematic. At 8 and a half and 10 and a half we had to weigh up trauma of bereavement and re-bonding against likely outcome—in Bandit’s case, at 10 and a half and being so dependent on Rose due to his blindness we think he would have simply stopped eating and had a miserable end. Going together gave each some comfort, and Rose who had always been so loving and patient with Bandit deserved that even if it meant his life ended a few weeks before he was ready.
The last day:
I am so so lucky and so are the bunnies. I am so lucky to be able to pay the vet bill. I know what a worry this was at other times—how unfair it is that all animals can’t have the same best treatment regardless of money. And I am so glad I am just retired. I was able to sit out with them for nearly a week and spoil them and make sure they were as happy as possible.And they were cheery and active which made the decision even harder. I was lucky to be able to schedule their favourite vet to come at the right time and she was very caring and skilful. Blueberries and grapes and every form of delicious treat and every minute precious. They got 3 sunny days and winter has not yet come with rain and wind for outdoor bunnies.
Stop reading here--- Euthanasia:
Our vet said with old or ill animals the vein can be hard to find and cause pain, so we agreed a muscle shot of anaesthetic exactly as if they were being put under for an operation, only an overdose to be sure. Then injection into the heart. For anyone going through this, keep talking to your pet during and after the anaesthetic they may hear you and be comforted by your voice.
We brought the bunnies onto their towel on their familiar treatment table at home and both bunnies ate half a grape just before they got their shot. Poor Rose winced with the injection into her flank. But Bandit just went slowly woozy. We put them nose to nose on their towel while the anaesthetic worked and stroked them and talked to them. Then the vet injected into the heart. Bandit went very quickly. Rose moved, and had another shot of the anaesthetic. Both made little mouthing and lapping movements with their tongues—the vet said that was absolutely normal with the anaesthetic. Also the eyes don’t close. This highlighted the importance of eyedrop lubrication during an anaesthetic to prevent corneal ulcers. Also it is normal, she said, to have tremour in the paws after death, or a big exhalation of breath. Because this is such a painful memory it is so important to know that these are totally unconscious pain-free involuntary movements of the body.
I’ve never had the courage to look at the Rainbow Bridge section, so I am going to do that soon. The hardest thing for me has been the loss of that infectious joy and the living in the now—not much we can vow to protect and cherish except if we are lucky our animals, because the timescale is so short. What a delight to see them happy and healthy!!!!
There is another story following on from this, in another thread. Our foster bunny is now an only bunny, and he is suddenly fearful going out in his grazing corral without two other pairs of ears and eyes to keep watch. I am sitting out with him morning and evening, and maybe he could become a house bunny. I will be reading all the postings on converting an outdoor bunny to a house bunny, and hope we can lavish enough love on him to keep him happy. Maybe even when we get over this, a bunny companion. Shebunkin
Thank you all so much --Debster, Kermit, Sky-O, Bunnylover 177,, Mighty Max, Ninny 40 and all on this wonderful forum for the wonderful support and the very helpful and detailed information, which I have kept to share with others. I hope the below may be of some help to others.
I will tell you all more at the end of this post but I’m afraid it may make you cry so maybe skip the end of this post unless you need to know details of euthanasia.
The short update is that a week ago both Rose and Bandit were put to sleep side by side, nose to nose, and as painlessly as anything like this can be. Since we made the decision I have been in bits and couldn’t bring myself to do anything except care for the bunnies in their last days. Yesterday I went onto this site for the first time I felt I could cope to do so.
I want to say thank you so much kind bunny friends for all the replies and sorry not to have got back sooner with news. Bandit and Rose are safe from pain now and I think it was the right decision for them, but absolutely awful for me. We have to be brave enough to do the right thing.
The health details: We saw 2 vets, both rabbit savvy—both of the opinion that Rose was beyond anything but palliative care. Rose’s teeth appeared good to the vet using otoscope. We ruled out an xray under GA.I brought a printout of the Bicillin reference. My vet knew about the subject and had had been on recent training seminars with Sharon Robrobe--- We felt that without invasive treatment-- eg extracting the teeth which had very tangled extended roots, the abscess, even if drained or treated with pennicillin type injection, would have just filled up again.
My OH had to go away for a fortnight and left the bunnies in my care. This was difficult. The 2nd day after the vet saw her Rose came out at breakfast time lively and interested in grazing. Bandit was very attentive. I did not notice immediately that the abscess had burst**************
Skip to next para if you don’t have a strong stomach… Clearly the pressure of the abscess had given her discomfort despite the increased Metacam--because she was so markedly perky after it had drained a little. Bandit the sweetheart had cleaned it all up overnight—not a nice job. The hair around the drain hole had dropped out leaving a pink area and the hole had plugged up again. Rose had a sticky bottom -- I didn’t want to mess her about unnecessarily, but there were a lot of flies. I decided to clean her bottom, and at the same decided to gently open the plug – it didn’t hurt her—but the pus absolutely gushed out—it was very liquid—not like the toothpaste consistency I once had to deal with with a previous tooth root bunny (also eventually PTS I’m afraid) Even though I cleaned the fur around it, flies kept buzzing up—I sat with the buns out in their run and made sure the flies couldn’t settle. ***************
For anyone in this situation, it definitely relieved Rose for the pressure to be lessened—however this bought a short respite only-- it did keep filling up. (The vet said Bandit’s stomach would be able to kill off bacteria he swallowed in grooming it. He showed no ill effects over the next few days.) I hope allowing it to burst naturally and not be painfully lanced was the right decision on my part. It also made me realise how easy it is to misread the signs of illness—Rose had become more quiet but I thought it was arthritis and simply increased her Metacam. I now believe that the tooth roots had been overgrowing for many months or even years. I had felt a hard area under Rose’s jaw many months earlier and thought to myself and even mentioned it to the vet ‘query tooth roots’--but Rose appeared well always enjoyed her food and our attention was on Bandit ‘s corneal ulcers and somehow—amazingly-- I forgot completely about this. I don’t think even at that early stage we would have countenanced invasive difficult surgery and in-patient treatment-- which seems so barbaric for rabbits--especially outdoor bunnies—all the stress of a totally alien environment, smells, temperature, other patients--predator animals.
So it is an unanswered question if we could have treated it earlier.
Like others on this site I felt terrible for not noticing the abscess until it was huge—she had a shaggy moult going on, but I now know that abscesses can blow up very quickly.
The dilemma was that both bunnies were actively Ec and so bonding with another would have been problematic. At 8 and a half and 10 and a half we had to weigh up trauma of bereavement and re-bonding against likely outcome—in Bandit’s case, at 10 and a half and being so dependent on Rose due to his blindness we think he would have simply stopped eating and had a miserable end. Going together gave each some comfort, and Rose who had always been so loving and patient with Bandit deserved that even if it meant his life ended a few weeks before he was ready.
The last day:
I am so so lucky and so are the bunnies. I am so lucky to be able to pay the vet bill. I know what a worry this was at other times—how unfair it is that all animals can’t have the same best treatment regardless of money. And I am so glad I am just retired. I was able to sit out with them for nearly a week and spoil them and make sure they were as happy as possible.And they were cheery and active which made the decision even harder. I was lucky to be able to schedule their favourite vet to come at the right time and she was very caring and skilful. Blueberries and grapes and every form of delicious treat and every minute precious. They got 3 sunny days and winter has not yet come with rain and wind for outdoor bunnies.
Stop reading here--- Euthanasia:
Our vet said with old or ill animals the vein can be hard to find and cause pain, so we agreed a muscle shot of anaesthetic exactly as if they were being put under for an operation, only an overdose to be sure. Then injection into the heart. For anyone going through this, keep talking to your pet during and after the anaesthetic they may hear you and be comforted by your voice.
We brought the bunnies onto their towel on their familiar treatment table at home and both bunnies ate half a grape just before they got their shot. Poor Rose winced with the injection into her flank. But Bandit just went slowly woozy. We put them nose to nose on their towel while the anaesthetic worked and stroked them and talked to them. Then the vet injected into the heart. Bandit went very quickly. Rose moved, and had another shot of the anaesthetic. Both made little mouthing and lapping movements with their tongues—the vet said that was absolutely normal with the anaesthetic. Also the eyes don’t close. This highlighted the importance of eyedrop lubrication during an anaesthetic to prevent corneal ulcers. Also it is normal, she said, to have tremour in the paws after death, or a big exhalation of breath. Because this is such a painful memory it is so important to know that these are totally unconscious pain-free involuntary movements of the body.
I’ve never had the courage to look at the Rainbow Bridge section, so I am going to do that soon. The hardest thing for me has been the loss of that infectious joy and the living in the now—not much we can vow to protect and cherish except if we are lucky our animals, because the timescale is so short. What a delight to see them happy and healthy!!!!
There is another story following on from this, in another thread. Our foster bunny is now an only bunny, and he is suddenly fearful going out in his grazing corral without two other pairs of ears and eyes to keep watch. I am sitting out with him morning and evening, and maybe he could become a house bunny. I will be reading all the postings on converting an outdoor bunny to a house bunny, and hope we can lavish enough love on him to keep him happy. Maybe even when we get over this, a bunny companion. Shebunkin
To let both go together was so kind and selfless. They were very lucky buns to have you. Rose and Bandit will never be apart. I'm so sorry 
