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Culture and sensitivity test...U/D it's bordetella
- Thread starter AnnieElms
- Start date
GrahamL
Wise Old Thumper
Thanks! Bless her, she was just making sure that the vet had all the nasty bacteria he needed
Sorry one more Q...does the vet have the 'tools' for this in the surgery normally, or does it have to be specially booked?
They should have the swabs in the surgery :wave:
Aha, same thing happened with Ben! When he went for his booster I mentioned that I wnated a culture and sensitivity test done and the vet tried to put me off, but could tell I wasnt going to back down. He told me to bring ben in when he was quite snuffly as they would be able to get a more reliable swab, but I honestly dont think it made a difference, as there was snot up his nose anyway, and he sneezed a lot when they did the swab!
Thanks! Bless her, she was just making sure that the vet had all the nasty bacteria he needed
Sorry one more Q...does the vet have the 'tools' for this in the surgery normally, or does it have to be specially booked?
The vet will have the necessary kit in the surgery :wave::wave::wave:
The vet would normally use a sterile swab - like a cotton bud for babies - which is in a plastic tube to keep it sterile so only the bacteria in the wound / abscess / ears etc are on it. It is wiped round the affected area to pick up lots of infected gunk. It only takes seconds and would be a little uncomfortable for bunny but shouldn't cause pain.
It then goes to a laboratory where it will be rubbed onto a special plate of jelly, discs of paper with antibiotics on them are placed on top and the petri dish is put in an incubator for a few days so that the bacteria can grow. Hopefully, there will be no growth round one of the antibiotic discs and this will be the one which the bacteria are sensitive to - so your vet will prescribe this.
The swab could also be used to rub some gunk onto a microscope slide to have a quicker assessment of bugs present, but this won't tell you which antibiotics are going to work best.
Hope this helps. Good luck to you and your bunny.
It then goes to a laboratory where it will be rubbed onto a special plate of jelly, discs of paper with antibiotics on them are placed on top and the petri dish is put in an incubator for a few days so that the bacteria can grow. Hopefully, there will be no growth round one of the antibiotic discs and this will be the one which the bacteria are sensitive to - so your vet will prescribe this.
The swab could also be used to rub some gunk onto a microscope slide to have a quicker assessment of bugs present, but this won't tell you which antibiotics are going to work best.
Hope this helps. Good luck to you and your bunny.
Thank you, that is really helpful
I think I will call and speak to the vet today, and ask him about it before booking the appointment. I don't want to take Bunny to the surgery if all we are going to do is discuss it and have to go back for the test. Unless of course the vet needs to have another look at him before agreeing to the test. He does know all about Bun's problems, so hopefully will be able to just do the test.
It's a very routine procedure. It would be done on the spot during a normal appointment. Sometimes it might be easier for a vet nurse to help out, depending what is being prodded.
Sometimes it may not be appropriate - there may be not enough gunk to take a sample. Sometimes the antibiotic may not be any different to one that you would be routinely given (eg baytril) so you could be delaying treatment by waiting days for a result (and paying more). Sometimes you do not get a result as the bugs just don't grow so can't be tested against a range of antibiotics.
What has your vet already said / done?
Sometimes it may not be appropriate - there may be not enough gunk to take a sample. Sometimes the antibiotic may not be any different to one that you would be routinely given (eg baytril) so you could be delaying treatment by waiting days for a result (and paying more). Sometimes you do not get a result as the bugs just don't grow so can't be tested against a range of antibiotics.
What has your vet already said / done?
Thanks for all your info.
Bunny used to have a non-bunny savvy vet, who treated over and over again with courses of Baytril. Sadly at the time I was not knowledgeable enough to know that this wasn't really helping. The snuffles never went away. Eventually I moved vets to the bunny savvy ones, and my new vet thought that either baytril wasn't the right drug, or that Bunny had built up a resistance to it.
I have had numerous discussions with the new vet about it, and as Bun was always very stable with the snuffles (ie it wasn't getting worse) he thought it best to not treat. But of course he said the moment Bun goes downhill, we will do the c&s test and get some treatment started again. I have followed my vet's advice, however two things have now made me think we need to go for treatment again:
1) Bunny went into boarding recently, and the lady there who always boards my buns said she thought his sneezing had worsened since his last visit.
2) Bunny has had two very mild stasis episodes this week. He has always had a troublesome tummy, and I have never quite got to the bottom of it, but I wonder if the snuffles is contributing. Of course I don't know this for sure, and there could be many reasons for the tum problems, but I would like to rule this out.
Bunny has lived with his snuffles for a while now, and I feel it is time to put a bit more effort into trying to treat this, as it does seem to be deteriorating a bit now
Thanks
I called the surgery a little earlier, and my vet is going to call back later so I can ask him what's best for Bunny. I like to check things on RU when I can, so I have a better idea of what I'm talking about and asking for when I speak to the vet, so thanks for all your advice. I will post back when I've spoken to the vet
Pebblesetc
Mama Doe
Hope the C&S turns up some useful info so that you know where to go from here. Big cuddles for Bunny <3
Buckley's C&S was done consciously. The vet wrapped him up in a towel and swapped his nose. Buckley helped by blowing his nose when the swab was in it to try and get it out, there were lots of bunneh boogerz :mrgreen:
Buckley's C&S was done consciously. The vet wrapped him up in a towel and swapped his nose. Buckley helped by blowing his nose when the swab was in it to try and get it out, there were lots of bunneh boogerz :mrgreen:
Nice!!
Yes, hopefully we can have it done and be a bit more proactive about the snuffles. I was never quite comfortable leaving it untreated, but I do trust my vet. But it worries me that it could be stressing him out so much that it might be contributing to his tummy issues. I hope we can get him a bit more comfortable
Santa
Wise Old Thumper
My personal view is that you're unlikely to get a decent nasal C&S sample from a conscious bun; it's possible, of course, but perhaps not always likely. The pockets of infection are so high up in the nasal passages that it wouldn't be possible to get a swab properly up there. All you're going to get from the nasal passages is a blob of pus - but of course pus is dead bacteria, so nothing is going to grow! It might be worth a go, and you might be lucky, but I think you stand more chance from either a swab taken under sedation, or something my vet has done before, which is to do a tear duct flush (can be done conscious with local anaesthetic) and to collect and send the flushings for analysis. The tear ducts drain through the nose so you perhaps stand more chance of it flushing through some live bacteria as well.
Another thought is that often snuffles is secondary to another problem, such as tooth root overgrowth. This particularly occurs to me because you say your bunny has had stasis a couple of times. Stasis can be a symptom of pain - so it makes me wonder if perhaps your bun has tooth root issues which are causing dental/nasal pain, and this in turn is causing infection and stasis. Just a thought - and is something that could be checked on an x-ray.
If this was my bun, personally, if he's in otherwise good health, I'd probably go for a sedated x-ray and C&S swab. But of course your vet will be able to examine your little chap and decide what's for the best, but there are several options. Good luck
Another thought is that often snuffles is secondary to another problem, such as tooth root overgrowth. This particularly occurs to me because you say your bunny has had stasis a couple of times. Stasis can be a symptom of pain - so it makes me wonder if perhaps your bun has tooth root issues which are causing dental/nasal pain, and this in turn is causing infection and stasis. Just a thought - and is something that could be checked on an x-ray.
If this was my bun, personally, if he's in otherwise good health, I'd probably go for a sedated x-ray and C&S swab. But of course your vet will be able to examine your little chap and decide what's for the best, but there are several options. Good luck
My personal view is that you're unlikely to get a decent nasal C&S sample from a conscious bun; it's possible, of course, but perhaps not always likely. The pockets of infection are so high up in the nasal passages that it wouldn't be possible to get a swab properly up there. All you're going to get from the nasal passages is a blob of pus - but of course pus is dead bacteria, so nothing is going to grow! It might be worth a go, and you might be lucky, but I think you stand more chance from either a swab taken under sedation, or something my vet has done before, which is to do a tear duct flush (can be done conscious with local anaesthetic) and to collect and send the flushings for analysis. The tear ducts drain through the nose so you perhaps stand more chance of it flushing through some live bacteria as well.
Another thought is that often snuffles is secondary to another problem, such as tooth root overgrowth. This particularly occurs to me because you say your bunny has had stasis a couple of times. Stasis can be a symptom of pain - so it makes me wonder if perhaps your bun has tooth root issues which are causing dental/nasal pain, and this in turn is causing infection and stasis. Just a thought - and is something that could be checked on an x-ray.
If this was my bun, personally, if he's in otherwise good health, I'd probably go for a sedated x-ray and C&S swab. But of course your vet will be able to examine your little chap and decide what's for the best, but there are several options. Good luck
Thanks Santa.
Yes, tooth root issues had crossed my mind (in moments of horror). He is a nethie, and I *think* the breed is more prone to this, so perhaps it is worth having a good old chat to my vet about all of these possibilities. The thought of a GA scares me, as he obviously isn't in great health and would be at a higher risk of something going wrong. BUT if it was the only way to find out for sure how to best treat him, then we must consider it.
I feel so sad that we spent all that time at the other vets and due to my ignorance in thinking he knew best, the snuffles got worse when really we might have been able to control it better at that early stage with the right treatment.
Thanks for your post. I will update later.
We all worry about GAs, especially if the rabbit is not 100%. Ultimately, it could be better to get to the source of the problem before it gets worse than have to go through more procedures when the rabbit is even more poorly. eg xrays if it may be a dental issue.
I have had a stasis prone dental lionhead with a calcified lung go through many GAs up until he died of other causes age over 9 years. I was always prepared to lose him under GA but justified it to myself on the basis that he needed the treatment at that time and would have had a lingering and painful death without it. The GAs were the only option for me and this rabbit. It didn't stop me being a nervous wreck each time, though.
See what your vet suggests and go for the options you think are best for both of you. You are obviously worried to be discussing it with your vet anyway.
I have had a stasis prone dental lionhead with a calcified lung go through many GAs up until he died of other causes age over 9 years. I was always prepared to lose him under GA but justified it to myself on the basis that he needed the treatment at that time and would have had a lingering and painful death without it. The GAs were the only option for me and this rabbit. It didn't stop me being a nervous wreck each time, though.
See what your vet suggests and go for the options you think are best for both of you. You are obviously worried to be discussing it with your vet anyway.
