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Rabbit that never got pee trained?

gimkeat

New Kit
We have two bunnies: one ND/HL cross (Little White) and another ND/local cross (Little Grey)

We have adopted White since he was 7-8 weeks and he has been a perfect bunny in terms of pee training department. However, when we adopted Grey when he was about 6-8 months old, and he never got 100% pee trained.

Two months ago, we had decided to put them together in a big cage, hence we brought them to a respectable vet to undergo neutering op. We bonded them slowly after their recovery from the neuter and they responded to each other well.

Since mid May, we have put them together in the same cage. They have never humped each other or fighted since then. White has still been perfect in the pee train department, he was 100% litter trained before and after the neuter, even after he got a new cagemate. However, Grey has never been pee trained until now. In normal days, Grey usually pees outside the pee tray (the pee tray is high and big, and Grey can hop in easily) 4-5 times per day, especially when he is excited (eg. expecting for food) or when the lights are off.

We have got Grey for approximately 4 months, since then we have been pee training him (use paper to soak pee and put in pee tray, clean stains with 50% vinegar etc). We have been reading a lot and we are fairly confident that our training method is fine (we welcome any good suggestions though). Grey has been neutered two months ago (his testicles were not descended, vet had to make a small incision near groin to take his testicles out. Could this affect his pee train?) One point to note is that Grey never lifted his tail while he is peeing, that makes it harder for us to spot the exact time when he does it.

Currently our patience is running out, after 2 months of pre-neuter + 2 months of post-neuter pee training, he is still peeing 4-5 times outside the pee tray per day. Is it possible that Grey might never get pee trained? Or do you have any special ways of pee training him to share with us? We really do not know how to deal with him anymore. Thank you!
 
How many litter trays do you have available to your buns?
Do they have one each?
Is Grey peeing in any specific place or all over the place?
Do the buns have a hay racks secured above/near their litter trays so they can much & pee at the same time ie making the litter tray more attractive to be in.

This may help too -
http://www.rabbitwelfare.co.uk/resources/content/info-sheets/housetrain.htm

Previously i had 2 litter trays for them but it did not work out, hence a few weeks ago i have swapped them into one big litter tray, hopefully to reduce confusion. All pee trays have hay racks secured above them.

Grey is peeing all over the place, completely random. :(

Thanks!
 
A while ago Grey was munching his hay in the litter tray, then suddenly he just hopped out and peed outside! When i realised it was too late. :cry:

sigh...
 
How old was grey when he was neutered? Sometimes late neutering can leave some ingrained marking tendencies. It's what's happened to my nutmeg. If she's put in a new area she will pee round the edges for a few months and then gradually she'll feel comfortable enough to not worry about marking.
 
Grey was neutered at about 8-9 months, he had been marking pretty often before neutering, so it could well be ingrained marking tendencies. Hopefully it will wear out eventually. :cry:
 
I've just spotted Grey sleeping on his pee. He was just lying there and when he got up, i found the flooring beneath was covered with puddles of pee. His abdomen fur was all wet and stinky.

Aren't rabbits naturally fond of cleanliness? How could Grey lie down onto puddles of pee by himself? :shock:
 
I've just spotted Grey sleeping on his pee. He was just lying there and when he got up, i found the flooring beneath was covered with puddles of pee. His abdomen fur was all wet and stinky.

Aren't rabbits naturally fond of cleanliness? How could Grey lie down onto puddles of pee by himself? :shock:

That would worry me a bit. I haven't experienced it myself but i believe incontinence can be a symptom of some things such as EC or urine infection.
 
I've just spotted Grey sleeping on his pee. He was just lying there and when he got up, i found the flooring beneath was covered with puddles of pee. His abdomen fur was all wet and stinky.

Aren't rabbits naturally fond of cleanliness? How could Grey lie down onto puddles of pee by himself? :shock:

Doesn't sound like normal rabbit behaviour to me: even if they pee outside litter tray etc, they wouldn't lie in it. Is he still eating plenty of hay or does his appetite seem diminished?
 
That would worry me a bit. I haven't experienced it myself but i believe incontinence can be a symptom of some things such as EC or urine infection.

Yes after reading OPs further posts I'm inclined to agree.
OP suggest it is time to have Grey vet checked.
Really hope you get to the bottom of this, you've obviously tried your best, been persistant & done heaps of research :)
 
Vet has checked out Grey when he got neutered and he was fine. I have observed this random urine and stepping/lying on pee behavior since i adopted Grey. What i think is he does not have "pee tray" or "maintain clean" concept in his little dictionary. :cry:
 
Doesn't sound like normal rabbit behaviour to me: even if they pee outside litter tray etc, they wouldn't lie in it. Is he still eating plenty of hay or does his appetite seem diminished?

he's eating plenty of hay, more or less same amount as White.
 
Vet has checked out Grey when he got neutered and he was fine. I have observed this random urine and stepping/lying on pee behavior since i adopted Grey. What i think is he does not have "pee tray" or "maintain clean" concept in his little dictionary. :cry:

Did the vet do urine tests?
 
Did the vet do urine tests?

Yes it came out clean.

I am pretty sure it is a behavioral problem. Grey does not have urine leakage problem, and most of the time he was munching hay, then leaped out of pee tray to urinate outside, and leaped back in continue munching hay like nothing happened before. :shock: This happens about 1 out of 5 times.
 
The fact he doesnt lift his tail pre-urination would make me think partial incontinence perhaps?

I have a bun, who just will not be 100% litter trained and never will be. Thats just part of who she is and whats wrong with her :)

She urinates in random places around the house.

The fact he sits in the tray and then hops out to urinate makes me think behavioural though too.

What do you have in the litter tray? Eg, what do you line it with, how is it setup?

Do you have a pic of your setup, that we could perhaps see to envisage what is going on to allow further suggestions?
 
I believe Grey has wry tail or lazy tail, his tail is always slanting to the left side.

I do not have a picture of the setup, it is just a normal plastic utility box with breeder celect litter, covered with bathroom mat with holes. The pee tray is place at the inner left corner of the cage, and it can fit both of the bunnies inside comfortably. Hay rack and water bottle are above pee tray and the rest of the cage is left bare (plastic bottom) with some chew toys.

How do you deal with your rabbit urinating randomly in house? Clean everyday? :cry: I plan to let them free roam in the house in the future, but it is quite impossible for us to track all the random pees daily.
 
I believe Grey has wry tail or lazy tail, his tail is always slanting to the left side.

I do not have a picture of the setup, it is just a normal plastic utility box with breeder celect litter, covered with bathroom mat with holes. The pee tray is place at the inner left corner of the cage, and it can fit both of the bunnies inside comfortably. Hay rack and water bottle are above pee tray and the rest of the cage is left bare (plastic bottom) with some chew toys.

How do you deal with your rabbit urinating randomly in house? Clean everyday? :cry: I plan to let them free roam in the house in the future, but it is quite impossible for us to track all the random pees daily.

Yes, quite simply this. If she has an accident, i clean it up. If i dont notice one, i clean it up when i do notice it :)

If you are going to have a house rabbit, you have to put up with some things rabbits do. Whilst they are domestic rabbits, they still are rabbits at heart. They'll still do rabbity things.
 
I too have a bunny proofed apartment and let them live free range but i reduced the space recently as I had similar problems training Jessica which seemed to help quite a lot. Jasper picked it up after about a week when we got him but we have attempted to train jessica for months and we still have issues

She usually pees in the cage but not always in one of the 2 litter trays. The other spot she likes is on the left hand side in front of the cage. I thought of the tactic of putting their food and water bowls in this spot which seemed to do the trick. Still struggling with getting her to use the litter tray all the time like Jasper but at least she does it in the cage now.

Giving treats when they do go in the litter tray might help but be careful, she now jumps back out when we get up as she knows what is coming. In fact sometimes she tricks us and sits in there just to get a treat without actually weeing. I think the best way is to wait until she has done a wee then treat her as quick as possible so she can make the association.

Despite all the tactics we've tried though which help, i agree that some just are stubborn about where they want to go. Jessica is much more nervous than Jasper and as she has become more relaxed, her habits have improved and hopefully they will continue to do so!
 
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