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Blueish snot? Pasteurella? Widget back from vets.

K

Kittykat23uk

Mama Doe
:cry:Hi folks, I'm in need of some advice. Widget seems a bit worse today, she's got a bit of a snotty nose, it's kind of bluish in colour. Last time we took her to the vet, he thought it was most likely an allergy, despite our regular vet previously treating for Pastuerlla. I've now booked her in for Tuesday evening, if she gets any worse obviously we'll take her to an emergency clinic but for now we're just keeing an eye on her. She's still very active eating etc, so I don't think it will hurt to wait this long and I'd rather see Stephan not the weekend vet and they haven't got any evening appointments on Monday (we work 8-17.00).

What sort of treatment should I be pressing for at this stage? She's already had a course of septrin. Are there any tests for pasturella that we could get done so we know she's got it or not?

Also Sprocket has started sniffling a bit too..

Thanks,

Jo
 
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I think you're making a big assumption that it's pasteurella.
A blue-green discharge is uncommon & usually caused by pseudomonas - the discharge has a distinctive smell too.

I always advise people to have a culture & sensitivity test done when the rabbit is fit enough, because many different bacteria can cause URTI & they need different ABx for effective treatment.
The main use of the "sensitivity" part of the test is to warn us if the infecting bacteria are resistant to standard ABx.
 
I think if any of mine had any kind of discharge I would be straight to the vets - it could be the start of something or linked to teeth, I hope it's not microscopic traces of blood making it bluish. I hope Widget will be alright, I'd be going on a emergency appt for that though:wave:
 
I think that although there may be some blood there as in any discharge where there is inflammation. Whichever the body fluid it's occurred in, it's either dark red or black - sooty if very dilute.

However I agree that buns go downhill very quickly & need to see a vet immediately symptoms appear.
 
Thanks for the advice there wasn't any blood, just a little bit of snot, like when you blow your nose, but it was kind of a pale bluish colour, I didn't notice any smell.

She seemed better again last night and this morning. She's eating, pooing running about etc. She has seen the vet a few time about this before but they haven't got to the bottom of it.

What does a culture and sensitivity test involve?

Thanks,

Jo
 
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Kittykat23uk said:
Thanks for the advice there wasn't any blood, just a little bit of snot, like when you blow your nose, but it was kind of a pale bluish colour, I didn't notice any smell.

She seemed better again last night and this morning. She's eating, pooing running about etc. She has seen the vet a few time about this before but they haven't got to the bottom of it.

What does a culture and sensitivity test involve?

Thanks,

Jo
Click to expand...

Taking bilateral swabs from the nasal passages to culture a growth to identify the bacteria involved and the most appropriate abx to use.
In order to obtain a swab from deep enough within the nasal passages a GA may be needed xx
 
Hi :wave:
As said above Id also be wanting a culture done. All it involves is taking a swab of the discharge from buns nose (not painful or invasive atall :)) then culturing (growing) the bacteria on a petri dish to find out what it is and which abx it responds best to. That way Widget will definatly be getting the best treatment :D
As Sprocket is sniffly aswell Id take her aswell and also get a culture done on her.
Loads of vibes :wave:

ETA just read Janes post, i didnt realise a GA might be needed just thought a swab of the inner nostrils was taken :oops:
 
Okay thanks for the info I'll ask Stephan on Tuesday. I think he's in the camp of not treating unlless it's really necessary for fear of just encouraging more resistance in the bacteria if present. I can see his point, especially as she is a young bun. What can I do to help boost her immune system? I hear echinacea is good, are there any products you'd recommend? :D
 
When Timmy and Mimi were abit sniffly at the beginning of last summer (just sneezing, no snot) my vet prescribed something called Tonivit. Its basically a mix of vitamins and nutrients which we had to syringe them with water for a week or so just to give them a boost and help them fight off anything that might have been lurking. Worked really well.
I live in France so it may not be called Tonivit it England, not sure sorry :?
 
Thanks Gemma, I'll ask about tht as well.

Just out of interest, does Pseudomonas affect humans as well?

ETA: just looked up Tonivet online, it does seem to be a purely French product. Anyone know of anything suitable in the UK?

Thanks

Jo
 
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Kittykat23uk said:
Thanks Gemma, I'll ask about tht as well.

Just out of interest, does Pseudomonas affect humans as well?

ETA: just looked up Tonivet online, it does seem to be a purely French product. Anyone know of anything suitable in the UK?

Thanks

Jo
Click to expand...

Although it can it's rare. It's called an opportunistic infection = there has to be other tissue damage present, with poor blood supply, before it can infect, like a burn or bedsore.

Many of the top vets now think that it's not so much that resistance occurs to the ABx as that the infection has spread to the sinuses which drain through tiny tubes into the nose. these tubes block easily. ABx from the blood stream can't get to the blocked sinuses so they reinfect themselves.

The whole key to treating this type of infection is getting the snot more runny, reducing the swelling & pain from the infection, & a minimum of 6weeks course of ABX. Obviously we want to make sure that there isn't a foreign body high up in the nose causing a block too.

So he full treatment for an infection at the back of the nose would be:
bisolvon or nebuliser to make the snot runny, metacam to reduce swelling & the correct ABx for the infection.

Once the infection has damaged the lining of the nose causing scar tissue, the snot can never drain properly, & the bun will always be prone to recurrence or need continuous treatment.
This is why I favour early aggressive treatment.
 
thumps_ said:
Although it can it's rare. It's called an opportunistic infection = there has to be other tissue damage present, with poor blood supply, before it can infect, like a burn or bedsore.

Many of the top vets now think that it's not so much that resistance occurs to the ABx as that the infection has spread to the sinuses which drain through tiny tubes into the nose. these tubes block easily. ABx from the blood stream can't get to the blocked sinuses so they reinfect themselves.

The whole key to treating this type of infection is getting the snot more runny, reducing the swelling & pain from the infection, & a minimum of 6weeks course of ABX. Obviously we want to make sure that there isn't a foreign body high up in the nose causing a block too.

So he full treatment for an infection at the back of the nose would be:
bisolvon or nebuliser to make the snot runny, metacam to reduce swelling & the correct ABx for the infection.

Once the infection has damaged the lining of the nose causing scar tissue, the snot can never drain properly, & the bun will always be prone to recurrence or need continuous treatment.
This is why I favour early aggressive treatment.
Click to expand...

I bought a Nebuliser from Maplins and it was awesome for Badger. You ca also nebulise Bisolvon as well as give it orally :)
 
I've run through the video a few times. Widget is a darling. :love:

The best place to look for snot in a bun is the inside of the front paws - from grooming themselves. Bless her she's giving them a good wash & brush up!! :lol:

I noticed the sneeze. I'm wondering if she's got a foreign body up her nose - pale blue is an odd description of pseudomonas. It might might be a water soluble dye from a foreign body coming down on the snot. Definitely needs sorting out.

Good luck, & please keep us updated.
 
Back from vets

Well we are back now, Widget is back on antibiotics but vet doesn't think she is too bad.. :? Sprocket is also a bit sniffly but she didn't think he was bad enough to treat. Widget's lungs are not too bad according to the vet, but her sinuses are not so good. She has been given a course of baytril for 1 week, 2 ml dose once per day. I asked about doing a culture but the vet wasn't keen. :/ She said its most likely pastuerlla and would be difficult to treat.

She just told us to see if she improves over the next week and come back if not. She's eating fine and is very active so the vets don't see it as anything majorly wrong and hopefully as the weather improves she will recover. I asked about giving her some echinacea but the vet was unable to advise on herbal remedies, but if Widget has a complete diet she should be getting all the right nutrition to support her immune system.
 
I wonder if the practice have anyone specifically trained to diagnose & treat rabbits though. Rabbits are very different from other animals (& humans) in may ways. Believe it or not, rabbits are classed as an "exotic species".:shock:
 
I know Stephan, the first vet we have seen, comes highly rated and Angela, the head vet nurse specialises in rabbit behaviour. He got Widget through a prolapsed rectum and spay when she was very young, and I know a few people on here who trust his judgement. As for the other vets I can't speak for them. I was hoping we'd see Stephan but it wasn't his time to be on.

We adopted them both from the practice and they know their history. As this is a companion care practice in PaH they do see a lot of buns with snuffles I believe. Its probably the fact that she is otherwise quite healthy and active that they are reluctant to intensify the treatment. :?
 
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