Yet another rabbit breeding/welfare poll

Okay, I'm curious about how far people actually would take the anti-breeding (or non anti-breeding). I know people can be quite vocal but I've a sneaky suspicion the majority are a bit more middle ground. So here is a poll with a few more options than just either or

So which do you agree with most and how do you think that will reduce the number of unwanted animals and/or improve general welfare?

I voted to educate the general public.

Even better Solution-educate breeders and pet stores to educate buyers that neutering there new pet is important, just as rescues do. Or maybe create legislation that makes pet stores neuter bunny's before sale- and breeders. Only breeding stock could then be bought for the sole purpose of breeding responsibly.This would mean that accidental litters would be a think of the past.

I think that the responsibility lies with educating the breeders that even though they may make a living out of selling pets- the general public are most often not interested in breeding when they get a bunny and often have accidental litters.

These accidental litters then end up in rescues and same with pet stores- many are mis-sexed by uneducated pet shop cashiers.

I think rescues should be educating the Suppliers of pets to be responsible. This is where there is a problem with the system. In fact- breeders and pet shop retailers should have legislation that enforces them to be responsible.

Breeders should be forced (by law) / or persuaded that encouraging neutering before sale is important.

The only buns that would be in rescues then are those from circumstances that have changed and those that have been neglected etc and taken away from the owners legally- both reasons being acceptable for why rescues should continue to exist.

Some circumstances- i.e someone loses there home - can't keep their bunny- these animals then need a rescue to go to. Again if there is a situation where bunnys are not being treated well etc- the rescue is helping by taking the animals into a safe and caring refuge.

These situations will always arise, because you can't tell what the future holds.

p.s 4am here- forgive me if my writing isn't that clear.

I voted ban backyard breeders and keep responsible breeders. Use education to reduce accidental litters

But have to say that responsible breeders should have to follow a code of conduct and carry out any health tests recommended for the breed, as well as taking responsiblity for any animal they breed, taking it back if necessary, they should also vet owners, ask lots of questions, educate new owners and turn people away if they are not suitable. Maybe animals could be chipped.

People should also have a reason for breeding why breed if you then have to advertise to find owners?

Another thing is many responsible dog breeders are also involved with their breed rescue so I would encourage rabbit breeders to do the same.

loppy ears said:

I voted ban backyard breeders and keep responsible breeders. Use education to reduce accidental litters

But have to say that responsible breeders should have to follow a code of conduct and carry out any health tests recommended for the breed, as well as taking responsiblity for any animal they breed, taking it back if necessary, they should also vet owners, ask lots of questions, educate new owners and turn people away if they are not suitable. Maybe animals could be chipped.

People should also have a reason for breeding why breed if you then have to advertise to find owners?

Another thing is many responsible dog breeders are also involved with their breed rescue so I would encourage rabbit breeders to do the same.

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This sounds like a sensible plan-I think back yard breeders will always exist because they are doing things below board most of the time, so they would go unnoticed unless they were reported. Maybe breeders could have a license or something.

I think that's a good point. Is who breed a rabbit and why really that important, compared to the education at point or sale and even the education of the owner themselves?

There are plenty of us here that have got rabbits from bad pet shops or bad breeders and that rabbit will do great because it's a got a good owner. Where it was bred doesn't have a big impact.

If we stopped focusing on categories of breeding or how good/bad it was and just insisted everyone selling a rabbit to a member of the public through whatever means (petshop/breeder/freead) supplied good care info (inc. neutered etc.) I think that would have a pretty big impact.

Tamsin said:

I think that's a good point. Is who breed a rabbit and why really that important, compared to the education at point or sale and even the education of the owner themselves?

There are plenty of us here that have got rabbits from bad pet shops or bad breeders and that rabbit will do great because it's a got a good owner. Where it was bred doesn't have a big impact.

If we stopped focusing on categories of breeding or how good/bad it was and just insisted everyone selling a rabbit to a member of the public through whatever means (petshop/breeder/freead) supplied good care info (inc. neutered etc.) I think that would have a pretty big impact.

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On the last point about having care instructions- i think that would solve an immense amount of problems. I can't remember getting any advice when i bought from a pet store in the past.

One of my first buns came from a breeder of my friend and i didn't get any advice there either. Rescues routinely give advice and care sheets so i think the care information is important.

I think pah don't give it because they supply a book instore for you to buy. It should be compulsory to give free and comprehensive information to the new owners of a bunny through any source of purchase.

I wonder how this could be enforced though on organizations and breeders alike.

Most councils actually have some variation of the below in their pet shop licence conditions already:

* Pet care leaflets or other similar written instructions must be made available to customers free of charge at the time of purchase, in addition to any offer to purchase pet care books or leaflets.

* Purchasers must be given proper advice on the care of the animal and, where necessary, on the maintenance and use of any accessories.

* Appropriate reference materials must always be available for use by staff.

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But it doesn't seem to be something that is much taken notice of by pet shops or councils.

Tamsin said:

Most councils actually have some variation of the below in their pet shop licence conditions already:



But it doesn't seem to be something that is much taken notice of by pet shops or councils.

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Wow that's shocking then- mind you is this something that was recently implemented - it has been along time since i bought from a pet store.

Animals are the new slaves.

Is it ok to have a slave if we look after them? Is it ok to have a slave if we've taken them from a worse situation and have put them in a better one? Instead of reducing the number of slaves, lets educate the owners in how to look after their slaves.

The bit I quoted comes from model guidance that was issued in 1998!

It's been a long time since I've brought from a pet shop too. Anyone that's had some more recent experience get written info? If so was it any good?

Tamsin said:

The bit I quoted comes from model guidance that was issued in 1998!

It's been a long time since I've brought from a pet shop too. Anyone that's had some more recent experience get written info? If so was it any good?

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We got a generic pet-care (non rabbit specific) leaflet with Rum & Raisin that advised if they were having problems eating, to give them a bit of mashed up chicken.

Hessen said:

We got a generic pet-care (non rabbit specific) leaflet with Rum & Raisin that advised if they were having problems eating, to give them a bit of mashed up chicken.

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Well I suppose it doesn't actually specify it should be for the same type of pet you are buying but :roll::shock:

I think educating new owners is a key point in animal welfare.

I wonder if it would be possible to get a national rabbit rescue organisation where rescues worked together under one name, with central funding, raising the profile of rabbits?

I think we have to get rid of the thinking of 'its only a rabbit'.

Hessen said:

Animals are the new slaves.

Is it ok to have a slave if we look after them? Is it ok to have a slave if we've taken them from a worse situation and have put them in a better one? Instead of reducing the number of slaves, lets educate the owners in how to look after their slaves.

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I don't know about that - I'm pretty sure all my buns would tell you I'm their slave.

Do you mean prisoners- in that case- yes they are in captivity or prison or a sanctuary- not in the wild.

Saying that i do like my prison i live in

I actually wouldn't have as big a problem with breeding if it weren't for two things...

1) The fact that there are too many rabbits compared to the number of available homes.

2) The fact that too many breeders concentrate on breeding "good" examples of a particular breed instead of breeding to improve the health and temperament of their animals.

If it weren't for the above I probably wouldn't mind as much. My impossible dream would be for there to be no rabbits sold in pet shops and instead people would have to purchase from breeders who only keep a few animals, don't breed from them too often and have them spayed and bonded after. It'd also be nice if these breeders also stuck to recommendations of the RWAF for housing, diet etc (so none with 30+ animals crammed into tiny cages) and were assessed on this regulary including spot checks.

It'd be much harder for people to get an animal on a whim and there'd probably be less in rescues as a result. Never going to happen though so it's easier just to say I don't really agree with breeding, especially not at this moment in time so I'm not sure what to pick. I guess it'd be "ban backyard breeders and keep responsible breeders. Use education to reduce accidental litters" but I don't think its responsible to breed dogs, cats and rabbits when there are so many unwanted ones already.

I think responsible breeders are fine, its the mills and irresponsible breeders that are the problem. Like Tamsin said in another thread, if resonsible breeders quit, people would buy from irrespobsible ones,. So that wouldn't fix the problem at all. I also think that people need to be educated so that they won't get rid of their pet when it doesn't behave the way they think it should (like people getting a puppy and not realizing they need to train and socialize it or not knowing how to :roll: ). And education on getting their pet fixed. The amount of people that still think neutering cruel :roll: Animals aren't people! Plus they don't know of the benefits of neutering.

1) The fact that there are too many rabbits compared to the number of available homes.

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Are there though

We don't actually euthaise many unwanted rabbits in the UK (as far as I'm aware) it's just many rabbits end up going through several owners before going to their final home.

If we still had the same number of rabbits born but instead of each going to home A then to a rescue and then home B, they went straight to home B, then we'd solve the rescue issue and improve the welfare of the rabbits (no stay in a bad home) and we don't actually need to persuade breeders to produce less. To achieve that we need to either stop people selling rabbits to owner A's and only to owner B's, or educate owner A's so they don't get a rabbit the will give up later, or a combination of both.

Tamsin said:

Are there though

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I guess it's a matter of opinion but I think so yes. I keep an eye on the SSPCA website and there are rabbits listed that have been in rescue for over a year. There's a few on the website associated with this forum that have been waiting a similar amount of time for a home. A good few months is a fair % of their lives so I don't think it's ideal that they spend it in a rescue. I know that many rescues will keep the rabbits well but the folk running them obviously have limited time and space to dedicate to each animal.

It's what 33,000 or some similar number for rabbits in rescue centres just now (not totally up to date myself)? This figure probably isn't even close when you consider that some rescues won't be counted and there are plenty of rabbits listed on preloved, gumtree etc. I'm sure that most of the folk running rescues would rather not be doing what they're doing and I'm inclinded to think that if there's a need for so many rescue spaces (in dedicated rescues and national SSPCA and RSPCA centres) then there's too many rabbits.

I do agree that people need to be better educated before taking a rabbit or any other pet on for that matter. It'd be nice if there were no accidental (and "accidental-on purpose") litters but that'd come under education too I guess. I think that in general it needs to be much harder to get hold of a pet animal in this country.

As i have said on another thread the rabbits that i did breed all left here with as much info as i could give a folder full of leaflets that are from the rabbit welfare site and it was surprising how many new owners liked getting all the info to help them
So i do think people like to get information about how to look after their new pets but alot of breeders dont want to put in that extra bit of time to provide new owners with the information.
I also do believe that if every vet had just a a few days a year when they reduced the rates of neutering alot more people would get it done or even if vets/breeders/shops could give money off vouchers to new pet owners towards it that would also help
Perhaps they should make a law that all pets must be neutered or less they are going to be homed to a breeder who has a licence to breed.

Crunchie said:

It's what 33,000 or some similar number for rabbits in rescue centres just now (not totally up to date myself)? This figure probably isn't even close when you consider that some rescues won't be counted and there are plenty of rabbits listed on preloved, gumtree etc. I'm sure that most of the folk running rescues would rather not be doing what they're doing and I'm inclinded to think that if there's a need for so many rescue spaces (in dedicated rescues and national SSPCA and RSPCA centres) then there's too many rabbits.

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The 33,000 is total taken in per year. I think it's fairly accurate as a few surveys have been done and came up with the same figure. It takes into account all rescues (by using averages for those that don't submit figures) but not rabbits that are rehomed by their owners.