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Grim's poo problems

Jenova

Jenova

Wise Old Thumper
Grim was fast asleep on my bed again and I got the cutest picture. Then I realised his bun was covered in poo. I tried to clean him up but he fought me and was getting seriously stressed so I've left him for now. But I have come to the conclusion that it's cecals on his bum not diarrhoea. Originally I thought something in my room was upsetting his stomach but I think now it just sticks to things in my room more or I notice it more on my white bedding. :? He only eats excel junior pellets now and it's a common problem to have excess cecals on excel food. So now I'm not sure what to do. I don't want to swap him over as they are the only pellets he's ever eaten. He used to be a muesli bunny.

Poor Grims. I'm going to have to clean him up some time tonight.
 
How much pellet do you feed him? It is also common for too many pellets to cause this problem...try cutting down on pellets and upping his hay xxx
 
He's a bit of a special case. He hasn't got many teeth and can't eat hay. So all he eats are soggy pellets and a lot of them. You are absolutely right about it being caused by too many pellets so in a normal rabbit I would follow your advice. That's why I'm not sure what to do. I'm off to the vets on Wednesday anyway...
 
Oh I see...didn't know. Hmmmm, would it be worth getting the vet to shave his back end...not very dignified I know but will help keep him cleaner. Also it will greatly reduce the chances of fly strike. I know there aren't many flies around this time of year but from Spring onwards, you could have a real problem!

Also, a wee bit of vaseline in the affected area would help prevent it sticking and therefore make the mess easier to remove....assuming vaseline isn't harmful....anyone???

A final suggestion, I know you can get liquid fibre for humans...you could ask the vet if there is an animal version, the extra fibre may mean harder poops? x
 
CharlieBabbit said:
A final suggestion, I know you can get liquid fibre for humans...you could ask the vet if there is an animal version, the extra fibre may mean harder poops? x
Click to expand...

There is, it's called Fibreplex. It never made a huge amount of difference for Mini though.

If he has tooth problems is he maybe unable to reach round and eat the pellets?
 
Fibreplex and Grim don't get on. It goes everywhere apart from in his mouth. :roll: I like the idea of the vaseline, I'll ask my vet what she thinks.
 
Jenova said:
Fibreplex and Grim don't get on. It goes everywhere apart from in his mouth. :roll: I like the idea of the vaseline, I'll ask my vet what she thinks.
Click to expand...

Does with Mini too so I put it on food. Mischa licks it off the tube :roll:
 
He gets so stressed when I try and clean his bum, there must be a better way of doing it. :?
I can't put him on his back because he freaks out so I wrap him in a towel, stick his head under my arm and lift his bum up to get to it. But he still gets stressed and grumpy. :(

He's calmed down a bit now but I haven't got it all. My room absolutely stinks of poo. It's disgusting and it's everywhere. I wish I had room in my garden for a shed, that would be so much more practical for them and me.
 
Awww poor Grim. :love::love::love: He really is one of the miracle buns on RU.
I'm so sorry to hear he's got mucky bum. I guess he doesn't like the smell either.:(
Can you remind me of all his issues again please Jenova? I've a feeling there's more to Grim than his teeth, & food preferences! :)lol:)
 
Well...
It started off with runny eyes and eventually they got so bad he got an huge infection and an abscess in his right eye. This is due to elongated tooth roots. They constantly run but can be kept in check by cleaning and Smoo helps too. He's lost a bit of sight in this eye and it's quite cloudy.

He's a regular dental bun with teeth growing at all sorts of odd angles. One is growing sideways. His teeth are also starting to fall out on their own and get rotten. My vet is trying to take some out when she does his dentals. I think he's lost about 5 molars so far.

He also had wonky incisors which turned out to be due to jaw abscesses in the roots both at the top and bottom. They were removed, the infection cleaned up as much as possible but it was also in the bone. He was on depocillin injections every three days for eight weeks and this cleared up completely as far as anyone is aware and is not an issue any more.

His diet is also a major problem. He has never, ever eaten hay. I got him at eight months (apparently) from a woman who (apparently) couldn't keep him any more. He was on muesli when I got him and I tried a few times to swap his food but he wouldn't eat anything I offered. Eventually I tried Burgess Excel Junior and he loved it. Big relief. I tried everything to get him to eat hay including putting it in treats. He would eat the whole thing and somehow spit out the hay and still eat the treat... He used to eat veg but when he got the abscesses he was obviously in pain although I didn't realise at the time and since then hasn't eaten any. Sometimes he'll eat the odd bit of cauliflower but when he realises it's not bread he won't eat any more.

He used to like apple but it really started to upset his tummy so that was cut out. Now all he eats are pellets. I soak them in cold water for him when his teeth are bad but he can eat them dry sometimes. And bread. I have been told this can stop the gut moving as it absorbs the digestive juices. He doesn't get that much, just a small square during the day and I hide his medicine on it as he hates anything going near his mouth so syringe feeding is a big no no. Sometimes he gets more as a treat, like the video you saw, but that's strictly rare occasions.

At the moment he is actually on no medication at all for the first time in months. His eyes are quite bad and he has a sore spot by his right eye where the fur has fallen out. I don't think it's an infection but I'm going to get a second opinion on Wednesday. I don't like him having too many antibiotics as I'm sure he'll become immune soon. :(

I think I've covered everything...

Edit: I should also say I feed him every four to six hour with a small bowl of pellets or soggy pellets. It's two of my handfuls but I have very small hands so about one and a half handfuls for a normal person. So he has a lot of pellets.
 
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:wave:You know what? You've done brilliantly getting the little man through all that.
I'm thrashing around as always. :oops::lol: But it seems to me that for several different dental reasons it's been uncomfortable for Grim to do much chewing for much of his life, & he's learned how to avoid the pain from pressure on his tooth roots AND get in enough food to keep him alive at the same time.

I did some experiments for Thumps once. I mushed up his pellets, & added a ground up mix of bramble/raspberry & strawberry leaves (to dilute down the high nutrient & increase fiber) starting with only a little at 1st.
Cos Thumps can't manage mush -just chases it around his bowl & gets it up his nose + sore lips, I had to make the mix up into little sausages & let it dry, until he could pick it up. :roll: That's the sort of route I'd be thinking of.

Grim is a fantastic & courageous little bun who's really done his best to keep going. Yep we've had the hay issues too. It's just too low in nutrients & fluid for them & takes up all the "chewing capacity" they've got. Beats me how they can spit it out into a nice neat pile so accurately!:shock::lol:

It's a very lonely, scary, & individual road for these buns who can't get enough food throughput. You've done Grim proud. Wish I could help more.
 
Thank you so much for your kind words. :oops:
I think you're right in saying it hurts too much for him to chew a lot and I think it would be more beneficial to go down the route of giving him more fibre naturally. I'll try him with some bramble leaves, you never know he might eat them. I know a lot of it is linked to his teeth, especially as when he eats something 'difficult' it also makes his eyes worse.

At the moment I'm just waiting for his teeth to rot basically. My vet is taking them out when she can and when they're all gone they should take most of his problems with them. I wish he wasn't so fussy and willing to try new food but I also know that it's all linked as he can't risk trying something in case it hurts.
 
Have you tried the profibre pellets made by protexin (same company that make fibreplex) - you can feed these alongside or instead of normal pelleted feed, or soften with water if preferred. :wave:
 
I've had a look at them, thanks. I might pick some up when I get paid but they are a little pricey... My sister already bought me some food designed for dental bunnies which is all natural.

https://www.thehayexperts.co.uk/Foo...kg.392.html?osCsid=1l7t7ler5pnc56i20d98iik1j6

And Grim won't touch it. I've broken it down into small pieces, soaked it in water. He just doesn't think it's food. So I don't know if he'll have the fibre pellets. He won't touch fibreplex and I've even put it in bread. :shock:

Is it these by the way?

http://www.protexin.com/products/pro-fibre-for-rabbits/32

I'm going to have to find some other ways of getting fibre down him. Most of the time he's okay and my vet said that while he's doing fine she doesn't want to start messing around with his diet, which I completely agree with. I don't know whether this is something that has just flared up, or I'm just noticing it more now they're inside...
 
I swear i just saw him eat a strand of hay... :?
I just cleaned out the big litter tray, put Wilkinson's hay in it and some barn dried grass on one side for noms. He hopped straight in to have a poo but then I heard weird noises and he was chewing and throwing his head back, really struggling to eat something. I thought perhaps it was a cecal and it was bothering a wobbly tooth. Then he started mouthing some of the barn dried grass and moving it about with his mouth. I didn't see hm eat any though... promising!
 
Wow!! Bless him for trying. He knows what he needs.:love:
As I understand it, the incisor roots often block off the tear ducts, but with Thumps it's molar roots which are growing into his eye sockets.

Can you grind some of that hay he was trying up so it doesn't need chewing, & mix a tiny amount in mushed up pellets? Like about 1/2 teaspoon in a normal pellet ration?
 
Jenova said:
He gets so stressed when I try and clean his bum, there must be a better way of doing it. :?
I can't put him on his back because he freaks out so I wrap him in a towel, stick his head under my arm and lift his bum up to get to it. But he still gets stressed and grumpy.QUOTE]

Poor baby, bum cleaning isn't pleasant for anyone. Schumi hated having it done but Mum and I did it together, so it might be easier to get some help. We used to quickly moisten him under a tap, then wrap him up. One of us held him on his belly while the other used to clean the nastiness off. It helped if we hung his bum over the sink while we were doing it. (Schumi was also a RIDICULOUSLY fussy eater with dental probs!)

Poor Grim. It's not nice at all for him.

Sending him love and eat healthy vibes.

:love:
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thumps_ said:
Wow!! Bless him for trying. He knows what he needs.:love:
As I understand it, the incisor roots often block off the tear ducts, but with Thumps it's molar roots which are growing into his eye sockets.

Can you grind some of that hay he was trying up so it doesn't need chewing, & mix a tiny amount in mushed up pellets? Like about 1/2 teaspoon in a normal pellet ration?
Click to expand...

It's Grim's molars too. I'll try that with the hay. And I can grab some brambles tomorrow evening. :)
 
dizzyg said:
Jenova said:
He gets so stressed when I try and clean his bum, there must be a better way of doing it. :?
I can't put him on his back because he freaks out so I wrap him in a towel, stick his head under my arm and lift his bum up to get to it. But he still gets stressed and grumpy.QUOTE]

Poor baby, bum cleaning isn't pleasant for anyone. Schumi hated having it done but Mum and I did it together, so it might be easier to get some help. We used to quickly moisten him under a tap, then wrap him up. One of us held him on his belly while the other used to clean the nastiness off. It helped if we hung his bum over the sink while we were doing it. (Schumi was also a RIDICULOUSLY fussy eater with dental probs!)

Poor Grim. It's not nice at all for him.

Sending him love and eat healthy vibes.

:love:
Click to expand...

Thank you. :)

He's a big bunny so it's hard to hold him over anywhere he doesn't want to be. :lol:
I have help tonight so I'll be trying again. He's a bit 'off' today but he does have phases, I think he's uncomfortable from the poo but I'm going to the vets tomorrow anyway. I've put a plastic sheet on my bed, the ones for bed wetting. It's got poo all over it so I'm glad I did, but poor Grims. :(
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