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kale and casper real issue!

beccimarie

Mama Doe
i have been trying to get casper off kale since i have had him because of the high calcium content but.. when i take it out of his diet he is like a child and wont eat anything and makes himself ill... he only has a small handful between the two of them, was just wondering what des too much calcium do? he has had it his whole life and he is 8 now :roll:
 
per week i use about a bag and a half of the tesco kale bags

:shock:

That is a lot of kale!

Can't you just reduce the amount slowly?

Calcium can cause sludge in the bladder i believe and some other problems too (but i can't remember, maybe have a search?).
 
I have this problem with Spenser too - he will eat other foods, but less readily. I have noticed cloudy marks from his pee since I bought him a bag of kale last week - which I only did because he was completely refusing spring grenns 9they are getting past their best now).
 
its between two of them, i hae tried reduceing before but he wont eat the hay without it mixed in :roll: find it so difficult and he is only just the right wieght aswell if he loses any he will be under wieght, ill have a research but it doesnt sound good :( so stuck on what to do
 
per week i use about a bag and a half of the tesco kale bags

:shock: That is a LOT of kale!!

I seriously would try reducing it down slowely as that is not a good veg for a diet to be based on tbh.
Have you tried him on herbs?
How about dandelion leaves, blackberry leaves and sprouts?
 
:shock: That is a LOT of kale!!

I seriously would try reducing it down slowely as that is not a good veg for a diet to be based on tbh.
Have you tried him on herbs?
How about dandelion leaves, blackberry leaves and sprouts?

i have tried everything, he is very fussy on wha he eats and if he doesnt like it he will leave it and make himself ill, i have tried and i come back in the afternnoon and he is so uncomfortable where he has not eaten anything,i have just read up on it and it causes them stones :roll: you dont think he has stones do you :roll: i will start reducing it again but what if he doesn eat? cant starve him?
 
I really sympathise, as I have had the same problem, but less extreme. Have you tried the smallish bags of ready cut and washed spring greens from Tesco? They are not an economical way of feeding your bunny, but Spenser will eat them whereas he totally rejected the whole greens currently on sale. I can't remember if you have tried rocket and flat leaf parsley with Casper - I believe they are not so high in calcium.
 
I really sympathise, as I have had the same problem, but less extreme. Have you tried the smallish bags of ready cut and washed spring greens from Tesco? They are not an economical way of feeding your bunny, but Spenser will eat them whereas he totally rejected the whole greens currently on sale. I can't remember if you have tried rocket and flat leaf parsley with Casper - I believe they are not so high in calcium.

i feel awful :cry: he has been having it for so long, he has normal leafy greens at bed time but maybe instead of kale in the morning i could mix up he sliced greens and he will think its like kale :) worth a go i spose my poor casper i hope he isnt in pain :roll:
 
Too much calcium in their diet can cause painful bladder stones or sludge as has already been mentioned. You really need to cut out as much as you can, it is difficult when you have a fussy bunny :( I like the idea of the sliced spring greens - to fool him into it!

What other foods do you feed him and is he a hay fan? High-calcium foods include bok choy (sp?), kale, parsley and probably spinach, so these should be seen as treat foods. Spring greens are about the best if you can get him loving them! Foraging is a great idea if you have some green about you as wild bunny foods are naturally low in calcium. There was an excellent foraging thread kicking about somewhere. Alternatively you could cut out his morning veg if he gets spring greens at night, he doesn't need to be fed veg twice a day as long as he has plenty of hay.

What is his urine like atm? High calcium urine is often described as being 'chalky' or cloudy.
 
Too much calcium in their diet can cause painful bladder stones or sludge as has already been mentioned. You really need to cut out as much as you can, it is difficult when you have a fussy bunny :( I like the idea of the sliced spring greens - to fool him into it!

What other foods do you feed him and is he a hay fan? High-calcium foods include bok choy (sp?), kale, parsley and probably spinach, so these should be seen as treat foods. Spring greens are about the best if you can get him loving them! Foraging is a great idea if you have some green about you as wild bunny foods are naturally low in calcium. There was an excellent foraging thread kicking about somewhere. Alternatively you could cut out his morning veg if he gets spring greens at night, he doesn't need to be fed veg twice a day as long as he has plenty of hay.

What is his urine like atm? High calcium urine is often described as being 'chalky' or cloudy.

his urine is yellow but milky looking, so yes i guess its cloudy :( he is very very fussy i have tried, all herbs,strawberry leaves,cabbage.. nothing he pushes it away, he only likes kale,greens,and carrots(only given as a treat) and pear (also only given as a treat) he eats hay but only if you mix in kale :lol: he isnt too keen but will nibble with a bit of kale too, he never was keen on hay but scince his last dental they took alot out and he can eat alot better, one thing he does like is dandelions now and again (he isnt too keen but will eat them) but i cant seem to grow them :? and there where some lovely big ones in a field near me that isnt used but people put me off as they may not be good to feed them i.e dog feaces and urine if i dont feed him veg in the morning by the afternooon he is hunched up and has a gassy belly
 
Well, the fact he likes greens is a good start :D Celery is another one to try, and dark lettuce such as romaine is good in moderation. I know some people have big problems persuading buns to eat hay, Susie bun's Spenser springs to mind. It may be worth looking at some of her threads for suggestions on increasing hay uptake, such as flavoured hays or hiding goodies in hay.

I used to pick wild dandelions and wash them, takes a bit of effort but the buns loved them. I've also frozen them, watching the look on their little faces when they bite into a frozen leaf is priceless :lol:

What does he actually do if you don't feed him kale? Does he just refuse to eat anything?
 
Well, the fact he likes greens is a good start :D Celery is another one to try, and dark lettuce such as romaine is good in moderation. I know some people have big problems persuading buns to eat hay, Susie bun's Spenser springs to mind. It may be worth looking at some of her threads for suggestions on increasing hay uptake, such as flavoured hays or hiding goodies in hay.

I used to pick wild dandelions and wash them, takes a bit of effort but the buns loved them. I've also frozen them, watching the look on their little faces when they bite into a frozen leaf is priceless :lol:

What does he actually do if you don't feed him kale? Does he just refuse to eat anything?

=] never tried celery, i am going to try and change kale to sliced greens, i put the excell apple bits in with the hay which encourages him but i have tried timothy hay, readi grass, but he only likes his bedding hay :lol: which is normal medow hay, but even that he only nibbles thats why he has had dental issues i try apple sticks but he pushes them away.

When i dont give him kale, he just sits in the corner and almost "sulks" i come back in the afternoon and go to give him his crunchie and he refuses and does a uncomfortable stretch i pick him up and his belly is hard, he refuses to eat anythig :shock: first i thought it was just he was poorly but i tried without kale again and he did the same! its almost like he is saying "dont give me kale then i wont eat anything :roll:
 
spring greens apparently have more calcium than kale http://www.houserabbit.co.uk/resources/content/info-sheets/calcium.htm

as ive already posted on the other thread values are based on dried veg so the calcium content does not account for the fact fresh veg is mostly water :wave:

i get through 3/4 bag of tesco kale weekly and since reducing pellets alot not seen any white pee. Alvins kidneys work just fine too according to blood tests.

too little calcium can be as bad as too much... i honestly would look at the pellets side to the diet before i took away veg i know is loved.

oh and for all the spring greens fans thumps has a theory about the connection between spring greens and stasis but i have no idea where to find that thread :oops:.. i havent fed any since Jan last year and Alvin is thriving on his 1/2 wild + kale & romaine & basil diet :love:
 
I think it's a similar thing to their poops, you need to keep an eye on output (in this case weewee) to be sure their input is ok. So if there's some obvious chalkiness or white grit coming out in wee then there's too much calcium going in.
 
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