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Grass Sickness - In Rabbits

The Duchess

The Duchess

Wise Old Thumper
Doing some research.

Does anybody know anything about grass sickness in rabbits. Have you experienced it yourself? Have you read any papers about it and can refer me to them?

Thanks in advance.
 
Rabbits can not actually vomirt, I do believe that too much grass can cause an upset tummy if the bun is not used to it.
 
I do not know too much about grass sickness, but I know many many horses that have died due to it, even though they received top spec veterinary treatment.
I'm sure it can occur in rabbits as horses and rabbits have extremely similar digestive systems.
 
rachylou said:
Rabbits can not actually vomirt, I do believe that too much grass can cause an upset tummy if the bun is not used to it.
Click to expand...

Thanks Rachel, but Grass Sickness is a specific ailment and is not related to rabbits being sick or eating too much grass.
 
*Spider* said:
I do not know too much about grass sickness, but I know many many horses that have died due to it, even though they received top spec veterinary treatment.
I'm sure it can occur in rabbits as horses and rabbits have extremely similar digestive systems.
Click to expand...

Thanks Hetty.

I think that there is more evidence now that rabbits are being seen with very similar symptoms to that of the illness in horses. I believe it's due possibly botulism or chlostrydium being present in the gut, via soil so it could follow that rabbits may be suffer the same way as horses.

There are some papers on it but I think that there needs to be more research.
 
The Duchess said:
Thanks Hetty.

I think that there is more evidence now that rabbits are being seen with very similar symptoms to that of the illness in horses. I believe it's due possibly botulism or chlostrydium being present in the gut, via soil so it could follow that rabbits may be suffer the same way as horses.

There are some papers on it but I think that there needs to be more research.
Click to expand...

Ooh that's interesting, never heard of it obtained from the soil, I always thought it was toxins found in grass or hay.
I'm absolutely petrified of it as the symptoms are just acute colic and in severe cases horses must be euthanised upon diagnosis.
2 of my friends horses were rushed to Newmarket and had gallons upon gallons flushed through their digestive tracts but unfortunately both died.
I don't get it though as apparently it effects the neurological system (I could be wrong)
I suppose a lot of our rabbits that show signs of GI stasis could actually be exhibiting signs of grass sickness.
 
*Spider* said:
Ooh that's interesting, never heard of it obtained from the soil, I always thought it was toxins found in grass or hay.
I'm absolutely petrified of it as the symptoms are just acute colic and in severe cases horses must be euthanised upon diagnosis.
2 of my friends horses were rushed to Newmarket and had gallons upon gallons flushed through their digestive tracts but unfortunately both died.
I don't get it though as apparently it effects the neurological system (I could be wrong)
I suppose a lot of our rabbits that show signs of GI stasis could actually be exhibiting signs of grass sickness.
Click to expand...

YOu see this is where I am coming from. I have had three rabbits of my own (so not just passing through) that have had very similar symptoms in the last 2 weeks. The vet has simply commented that he had seen something similar a while back and it resembled grass sickness.

In all three of my cases the rabbits have other issues so could be immunocompromised. But all have had to be treated with fluids, Zantac, pain relief etc. All but one have seen rapid weight loss. Soil is not a connecting factor in these rabbits as they don't have their runs on grass.

And you are right that the toxins could also be in grass/hay. Another one of our vets is thinking of seeing if there is a way to test hay/grass by dying as it's passed in spores and show up when dyed.

It's incredibly worrying for horse owners and am now wondering, as you suggest that it might relate to unexplained stasis in rabbits.
 
Thumps knows a little about it from Marie. Maybe Marie would be able to help you? I've heard a little about equine grass fever but no more than you've already mentioned. I think it is similar to what thumps has in terms of gut toxins paralyzing neuro control to gut but more acute? :?
 
prettylupin said:
Thumps knows a little about it from Marie. Maybe Marie would be able to help you? I've heard a little about equine grass fever but no more than you've already mentioned. I think it is similar to what thumps has in terms of gut toxins paralyzing neuro control to gut but more acute? :?
Click to expand...

Thank you......

Now that's a plan - I might message Marie and have a chat to Thumps tomorrow.

My latest, who is always spritely and a very good eater, has stopped eating today and has had everything thrown at her so far. Hope she remains comfortable over night and we can see some improvement in the morning.

With my other two, they have remained good eaters but just not producing anything to speak of - but in all cases the gut has gone very sluggish indeed with a mass of matter in the lower gut. Luckily for me, one bun, Noah has started to put a bit of weight back on but he dropped literally overnight and looked like a stick with a head on it.
 
this is interesting will be following

just a thought apart from toxins etc, does it seem more common at this time of year?

as over these months the grass slows in growth for the winter months, it stays wet and mulchy for a lot longer, overgrown bits flatten and start to ferment

this is just an observation from me

I belive certain foods shouldnt be given at certain times of year willow for instance i never give in spring while the lil "catkins" are growing ironically my buns refuse to eat it too but once it turns into full leaf they love it

be interesting on what thumps suggests:D
 
Last edited:
I'm no expert, but I'm sure I heard that current thinking is that it's caused by Clostridium Botulinum (which can be present in soil AND grass), and is distinct from Dysautonomia?
 
There's a thread about equine grass sickness in general chat last year started by ?halfpenny & ribbons contributes her experience. Marie contributes a post.

The cause is as yet unknown for rabbits & horses. Neil Forbes at GWR proved that the same type of illness in parrots - parrot ventricular disease - was triggered by a virus. The receptor site on the virus is so similar to that of the gut nerve cells that the immune system gradually destroys them. The diagnosis can only be made by examining part of the affected gut, & seeing loss of nerve ganglia microscopically at post mortem. This is very much Marie's interest. C. botulinum will cause paralysis, by blocking transmission across nerve endings but does not destroy the nerves.

Yes, my Thumper is thought to have dysautonomia (megacolon type disease) but has recently made a dramatic improvement over the last 6 weeks by eating blackthorn leaves. I have many questions to ask Marie when he has a dental on Fri.

Thumper's progress is minutely detailed in his thread. It is an effort to help others with this horrid fatal disease, as we explore the use of common wild plants to keep him going. The marked improvement is documented - http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/showthread.php?t=226422&page=69 #686.
onwards.
We encountered many unexpected issues on our journey from early signs of hock sores due to immobility, to massive issues with thermoregulation because he couldn't moult his winter coat, & even inability to absorb water. I am very happy to discuss it further with you.
Blackthorn leaves are only effective for about 6-8 weeks of the year in Autumn.

ETA Pretty Lupin drew our attention to the fact that shop veg are washed in Chlorine. There were a lot of "dysbiosis" issues last year at this time, including Thumpers rapid deterioration. Daisy Sunshine's conti Daisy, subsequently diagnosed as dysautonomia had her 1st. episode when she had shop veg along with Jester who made a full recovery. (Another person worth contacting)
 
Last edited:
thumps_ said:
There's a thread about equine grass sickness in general chat last year started by ?halfpenny & ribbons contributes her experience. Marie contributes a post.

The cause is as yet unknown for rabbits & horses. Neil Forbes at GWR proved that the same type of illness in parrots - parrot ventricular disease - was triggered by a virus. The receptor site on the virus is so similar to that of the gut nerve cells that the immune system gradually destroys them. The diagnosis can only be made by examining part of the affected gut, & seeing loss of nerve ganglia microscopically at post mortem. This is very much Marie's interest. C. botulinum will cause paralysis, by blocking transmission across nerve endings but does not destroy the nerves.

Yes, my Thumper is thought to have dysautonomia (megacolon type disease) but has recently made a dramatic improvement over the last 6 weeks by eating blackthorn leaves. I have many questions to ask Marie when he has a dental on Fri.

Thumper's progress is minutely detailed in his thread. It is an effort to help others with this horrid fatal disease, as we explore the use of common wild plants to keep him going. The marked improvement is documented - http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/showthread.php?t=226422&page=69 #686.
onwards.
We encountered many unexpected issues on our journey from early signs of hock sores due to immobility, to massive issues with thermoregulation because he couldn't moult his winter coat, & even inability to absorb water. I am very happy to discuss it further with you.
Blackthorn leaves are only effective for about 6-8 weeks of the year in Autumn.

ETA Pretty Lupin drew our attention to the fact that shop veg are washed in Chlorine. There were a lot of "dysbiosis" issues last year at this time, including Thumpers rapid deterioration. Daisy Sunshine's conti Daisy, subsequently diagnosed as dysautonomia had her 1st. episode when she had shop veg along with Jester who made a full recovery. (Another person worth contacting)
Click to expand...

:cry: I wonder how many rabbit PM's Marie has biopsied and found this? Would be interesting to know how common a finding it is in bloat/stasis fatalities on PM?
 
thumps_ said:
There's a thread about equine grass sickness in general chat last year started by ?halfpenny & ribbons contributes her experience. Marie contributes a post.

The cause is as yet unknown for rabbits & horses. Neil Forbes at GWR proved that the same type of illness in parrots - parrot ventricular disease - was triggered by a virus. The receptor site on the virus is so similar to that of the gut nerve cells that the immune system gradually destroys them. The diagnosis can only be made by examining part of the affected gut, & seeing loss of nerve ganglia microscopically at post mortem. This is very much Marie's interest. C. botulinum will cause paralysis, by blocking transmission across nerve endings but does not destroy the nerves.

Yes, my Thumper is thought to have dysautonomia (megacolon type disease) but has recently made a dramatic improvement over the last 6 weeks by eating blackthorn leaves. I have many questions to ask Marie when he has a dental on Fri.

Thumper's progress is minutely detailed in his thread. It is an effort to help others with this horrid fatal disease, as we explore the use of common wild plants to keep him going. The marked improvement is documented - http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/showthread.php?t=226422&page=69 #686.
onwards.
We encountered many unexpected issues on our journey from early signs of hock sores due to immobility, to massive issues with thermoregulation because he couldn't moult his winter coat, & even inability to absorb water. I am very happy to discuss it further with you.
Blackthorn leaves are only effective for about 6-8 weeks of the year in Autumn.

ETA Pretty Lupin drew our attention to the fact that shop veg are washed in Chlorine. There were a lot of "dysbiosis" issues last year at this time, including Thumpers rapid deterioration. Daisy Sunshine's conti Daisy, subsequently diagnosed as dysautonomia had her 1st. episode when she had shop veg along with Jester who made a full recovery. (Another person worth contacting)
Click to expand...

Thank you Thumps.

I will go on the thread and read it all, plus make notes to discuss further with my vets.
 
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