neutering

I don't know if this is just bad luck or what the answer really is

Since january last year we have only had 6 neuters done, 3 boys and 3 girls. Of those, 4 died during the op, 1 more died 2 weeks later, only Dasiy has survived so far. :? There ages ranged from 4 months to 8 years so it wan't just all elderly bunnies.

And yes I know a lot of them are old or have special needs, but compare that to the 20 or more dentals we had done last year, didn't loose a single bunny. We haven't lost a bunny under GA for anything except neuters ( except for Cherry who was incredibly sick when she arrived). I don't understand it

We now have 4 males here that need castrating at some point and one female that needs a spay. we also have little Wesley arrving at the weekend and we need to decide whether to go ahead with his castration or not :? We desperately want to get Dave neutered as he is craving company, but what do we do. I couldn't bear to loose him, he is the snuggliest bunny

Except for when there is a high chance of cancer and its been out of my hands all the neuter ops have been my decision, so it feels 100 times worse when you loose one because I choose to send them for the op. But if we don't get it done so many bunnies are going to end up living alone. But maybe its better that they live alone and have other buns around them than loose their lives :?

I wish I knew what to do for the best

differant vet maybe to do the neuters ??

We have 3 different vets who operate at our surgery and they have each done at least one of the bunnies, and they also do the dentals etc so I'm not really blaming the vets :?

ETA we have also requested different types of GA's with the neuters and that hasn't made a difference either

You have been really unlucky - I know that is no comfort what so ever when you have lost so many buns. If only we knew why??

I think you should go ahead with the procedures - practice what we preach :lol: in the long term it is better for them, you will do your very best for your bunnies so what ever you decide will be right but from an outsiders view if the bunnies are fit enough for the op I think they should have it!

Hard decision though and I too would be doubting it!!

Good Luck x

A hard one and I would be worrying in the same position. All my girls have been done in the last few years after losing Bertha. Only Kizzy didn't make it and that was 2 weeks after the op, she was 8, and she had abnormal insides when they opened her up. The others- up to 4 years old came through the op with flying colours.

I guess the thing you have to consider is the care before you took them and the care from the vet. If you are confident in the vet, it has to be the lifetime of neglect for many before they came to you. Unfortunatley, there is nothing you can do about that.
What is best- a life with a companion or with other buns nearby, only you know the individual and therefore know which is best for them.

i don't know what to say. i'm sorry you have had such a hard time and lost so many buns. it must be terribly difficult to go ahead with another neuter. and yet, you know why you have it done, so perhaps its best to go ahead, so they can be healthy and have a friend. but whatever you decide will be best, because you wouldn't do anything that didn't put the buns first.

oh my lord i feel even sicker now just posted a thread about feeling sick and worried as my boy is being done tomorrow morning

so sorry for losses what an awful time of it you,ve had ((hugs))

Rosiesmummy said:

oh my lord i feel even sicker now just posted a thread about feeling sick and worried as my boy is being done tomorrow morning

so sorry for losses what an awful time of it you,ve had ((hugs))

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But we take in rabbits with health problems so ours are going to be at a much higher risk, so please don't worry.

Its just so hard for us to know what to do for the best with ours because they have health problems but they still deserve a friend.

Dave, who we are worrying about has a head tilt, Hedgehog obviously has brain damage, Maddox probably has a heart condition, and Wesley has deformities so they are not normal bunnies. But they still need the love of another bunny :?

Is it the same vet as the one that messes you around all the time? in which case i would be tempted to question their specific rabbit knwledge especially in monitoring anaesthetics. If not then.....don't know. Personally i wouldnt neuter maddox as he seems happy enough with the boys anyway, nor anybun with significant congenital deformities - if they are boys and can be bonded with calm girls that can put up with their amorousness i'd leave them. So i'd only neuter those with problems that are unlikely to be affected by the GA or abdominal surgery etc. I dont think you can apply a rule either way to neuter or not.

We have one bun that is not neutered (Parsley: male) and TBH had it not been for us 'misinterpreting' Hawthorns fear of other rabbits for aggression - we should probably not have bothered with having him done. It is now clear that he is a scaredy bun - and so well behaved.

So have you ever thought of just not neutering the males?

VikkiVet said:

Is it the same vet as the one that messes you around all the time? in which case i would be tempted to question their specific rabbit knwledge especially in monitoring anaesthetics. If not then.....don't know. Personally i wouldnt neuter maddox as he seems happy enough with the boys anyway, nor anybun with significant congenital deformities - if they are boys and can be bonded with calm girls that can put up with their amorousness i'd leave them. So i'd only neuter those with problems that are unlikely to be affected by the GA or abdominal surgery etc. I dont think you can apply a rule either way to neuter or not.

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It is the same vet, but like I said they have done wonders getting my elderly buns through dentals. I don't have any worries about their surgical techniques, just the way they treat us personally and their prices.

Vikki would you neuter dave if you were me?

Hugo's There said:

It is the same vet, but like I said they have done wonders getting my elderly buns through dentals. I don't have any worries about their surgical techniques, just the way they treat us personally and their prices.

Vikki would you neuter dave if you were me?

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Depends....is his headtilt due to EC? does he have any other problems or deficits? whats his body condition like?

If he's otherwise healthy and normal, and doesnt have any persistent EC issues etc then i'd definately consider it. Pre-op blood screen for definate, pre-op panacur course and not until you actually have a partner in mind for him, just to give him the maximum time to be fit and healthy and in good shape nutritionally before the op. But as i havent seen him its a difficult thing to assess remotely.

VikkiVet said:

Depends....is his headtilt due to EC? does he have any other problems or deficits? whats his body condition like?

If he's otherwise healthy and normal, and doesnt have any persistent EC issues etc then i'd definately consider it. Pre-op blood screen for definate, pre-op panacur course and not until you actually have a partner in mind for him, just to give him the maximum time to be fit and healthy and in good shape nutritionally before the op. But as i havent seen him its a difficult thing to assess remotely.

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Thanks, thats what we were thinking. We don;t know the cause of the headtilt, were told he was born that way :? But he seems fit and well in every other way

Just because they have health problems doesn't be the boys aren't rampant :lol: Hedgehog is continually humping Spud-gun, I am surprised they haven't fought yet, and we are also having problems with the strong smell of hormones upsetting the other rabbits.

Maddox may not have big enough bits to be neutered but he is still occassionally humping eddie and is spraying and smells too. He went into stasis at the weekend because he humped eddie who took a dislike and to it and nipped at him

We sent Geordie in despite his deformities because he was humping everything in sight and was desperate for company, but we lost him as soon as he went under

So saying not to do it isn't that easy :?

Those are appalling statistics:shock:

I have had many special needs rabbits neutered and never lost a single one. Although I have had bucks who seemed perfectly healthy die under anesthetic for no apparant reason But that was when I wasn't as fussy about which vet did the ops. I will only let two of the vets at the practice do my rabbits now. I have only once lost a doe under anesthetic, and that was when she was restitched for biting her spay wound open by a locum.

Obviously you have to be sensible about whether a rabbit is healthy enough.

I left Loki unneutered for a year after he developed his severe head tilt. I bonded him to a big doe. As his mobility was limited she had no trouble getting away from him when he got too amorous. After a year he had improved so much that I had him done, and he was fine.

I did also leave an old buck with heart trouble unneutered and tried to bond him to a spayed doe, but he exerted himself so much I thought that would be the end of him! He would have died happy! But he started to pluck all her fur out so I had to put her needs ahead of his. He lived with pink bunny, who comforts all our lonely fellas, until his heart let him down completely.

Another ill old male I bonded to another buck. He wasn't too much of a pest. But he had a whole list of health problems and was pretty ancient.

I have a few does I have left unspayed due to health concerns, but also I have had ill does spayed and they have been found to have tumours which meant the risk was def worht it.

I have two does now that have snuffles that I would like to spay but don't quite dare. If they were bucks I would go ahead.

Heart problems prob carry the highest risk, so that one I would prob leave. The others I'd have to know more about them to decide.

I'm surprised you are so confident about your vets' abilities with stats like those. Dentals only require sedation really, not nearly as deep as for a surgical procedure, so the risk is far less for them, and the procedure only takes a few minutes, so they aren't under for long. Maybe you should ask what their success rate is for other people's rabbits.

Hugo's There said:

It is the same vet, but like I said they have done wonders getting my elderly buns through dentals. I don't have any worries about their surgical techniques, just the way they treat us personally and their prices.

Vikki would you neuter dave if you were me?

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I would definately consider using another surgery, you may have different vets operating on your rabbits but if they all use the same techniques, it might be they are missing something
I know from your other thread you have just lost Hester too, and from what I understand they examined her over a week ago, didn't they suggest admission so they could monitor her

I honestly don't blame my vets. Austin had a lot of health problems but was desperate for company, he used to chew at the bars of the other buns crates begging to be let in. When we lost him we had a pm done and it didn't tell us why it happened :?

Geordie was badly deformed and died because his lungs weren't developed properly. He was lonely too, we tried him with a female while uncastrated but he humped continually so we had no choice but to try. We did pre op bloods as well and they were OK.

Bigglesworth dies 2 weeks later from stomach disorders but he was rescued from somewhere infested with rats so it could have been a latent problem from this.

Missus died during her spay because she was riddled with cancer by the time she got to us

And Hester died yesterday. I don't know why her lungs suddenly filled with fluid during the op, she was running around at 100 miles an hour the evening before and was bright as a button yesterday morning. She had no breathing difficulties at all while with us, but obviously we have no medical history on her. I don't see how the vets could know this was going to happen.

We have also had incisor removals and leg amputations etc with our vet and all have recovered really well with no post op complication It is just the neuterings that we have bad luck with

Just to add, we have used the same vets for 12 years and in that time we have had a lot of neuters done and we have never lost a single rabbit, until last year.

So it has to be that the buns we are taking in have more serious health problems, which is why we are worried about the ones we have here now that need doing and the reason for the thread. As over the past few years we have realised that what seems an easy decision for a normal rabbit is actually a really hard one for our bunnies

I would have to agree on questioning your vets on their fatality rate with rabbits in general
That seems high

In 4 1/2 years we have lost 2 bucks and 1 doe being neutered, the two bucks were at a practice we no longer use and the doe's heart gave out as soon as she was put under GA

that is still only 3 out of hundreds..and we take in rabbits with problems and those who have suffered neglect
It could just be very bad luck but if I were you I would still ask some questions:?

Hugo's There said:

It is just the neuterings that we have bad luck with

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It's hard to say with 100% certainty but I do think that it could be exactly what you have said Liz - just extremely bad luck.

There are clear reasons for Missus and Geordie not making it and they aren't something the vet could have known beforehand. Hester's problems came completely out of the blue but, again, I'm not sure how it could have been detected.

That is absolutely no help to you in making neutering decisions for the future though, but I would say that you have to look at each case individually. It looks and sounds awful for you to say that only one bunny out of 6 has survived neutering in the past year, but those bunnies all had problems of one kind or another. I don't think you can even compare them to 'other bunnies with problems' because every single one will cope with a GA differently.

I have just remembered that we got Marnie spayed at the end of last year with no problems, as she was completely healthy. I had forgotten her as we rehomed her

I have worked out that we have had at least 30 neuterings done in the past, before things changed last year and we didn't loose any of them

I honestly don't have a problem with my vets surgical procedures, just the way they treat us personally re communication, costs etc. They have done some amazing things for our bunnies and have often had to pick up the mess that other vets have left with very little info. Look at Frank, he is fighting fit now thanks to the operation they performed after 2 different vets messed it up. Cherry is pain free because other vets missed her problems. Eddie is looking the best he has ever done after all the recent tests they performed. And they did a lot to help Timmy when he didn't have much going for him. I can think of many more examples

I don't know what else they could have done for Hester, it was me that made the wrong call for her, thinking the swelling that started to grow rapidly in her abdomen this week was just the fluid in her uterus. If I had taken her straight to them on Monday I am sure they would have diagnosed her problem but I expect the outcome would have been the same.

Considering the bunnies we have here, if I had no confidence in their abilities I would have stopped using them ages ago. We have only ever been looking round at other vets because we are fed up at the way they treat us rather than the bunnies.

I am only questioning the neuterings because this is where we have found there to be a major problem when it comes to our bunnies and 9 times out of 10 it is my decision to do the op, and I want to do whats best for our bunnies