Snuffles

Hi all, I recently adopted Woody a rex from PaH. I kept seeing him there and felt so sorry for him. Already have 2 male neutered lops- Biscuit and Landrover but this post is about Woody.
He has snuffles- white discharge from nose and sneezing. Took him to vets today who gave him antibiotic injection and took a swab. Is there anything else I should be doing while we wait for the result? He is otherwise fine- lively, eating, drinking, few binkies and I am keeping him isolated totally from the others.
Will try to post a photo in a moment.
Thanks in advance.:wave:

It can be a difficult illness for several reasons.

The best thing you can do is reduce the dust in his environment. I give my bun's hay a quick swish round in a large bowl of water to get the dust out.
There's using an aerosol with plain water to "damp down" dust when you do house work if he's an indoor bun.
You'll have to do this for the rest of his life.

There are various ways of treating it.
Perhaps it's best to see what your vet recommends first.

Thank you. yes, he is an indoor bun. I use the dust free hay which he seems to love. I guess I need to wait for the swab results to see if it is an infection or allergy. :wave:

I just recently have been treating one of my buns with Baytril and an antibiotic injection twice daily for 2 weeks. Touch wood it's done the trick but it can come back, as long as they keep on eating and pooping Woody should be fine. I have lost a 9yr old bun in the past to snuffles it had spread to his lungs and had stopped eating aswell.It was a very severe case.I hope it's an allergy as that is more easy to treat, keep us posted and get well soon Woody.

9 years is good though X

Bobbybobtail said:

Thank you. yes, he is an indoor bun. I use the dust free hay which he seems to love. I guess I need to wait for the swab results to see if it is an infection or allergy. :wave:

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I'd stick my nose in the hay & take a whiff myself to be sure.

The problem with dust is that it thickens the mucus, so it can't be propelled back into the throat properly & swallowed. The mucus acts as a trap for bacteria in the air. If the flow is slow, or blocked the bacteria multiply rapidly, & start to invade the lining of the nose which swells up, slowing flow further = more bacterial proliferation. It can also block the tiny tubes the mucus in the sinuses drains down, so there is infected mucus which AB's can't reach in the sinuses.

It's very much a matter of experienced first class vet judgement to get the treatment right. We don't want to over treat, but we don't want to under treat either. By under treating I mean short courses of AB's every few weeks or months.

A very severe case is described on the current thread http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/showthread.php?t=189817
It's heavy reading, & very much a worst case scenario, but you'll find most of the ideas about treating snuffles there.

With Matt the bug causing it isn't particularly nasty. The problem has been blocked sinuses, & getting swelling down, & mucus thin enough, so they can drain into the nose. This is because he just had repeated short courses of AB's by mouth every couple of weeks for too long. The problem now, is that there is probably scarring high in the nose on the left side.
Scar tissue doesn't have the microscopic hairs which move the mucus. So we are doing all possible to get the mucus as thin as possible.
We did not realize the significance of dust until recently. My own bun started sneezing. He doesn't have snuffles, nor has he an allergy, it's purely mechanical irritation. But he would have been a sitting duck for snuffles if I hadn't taken action fast.

Bisc, Matt's partner also had snuffles, but has had no recurrence after simple treatment.

Eveything crossed that all goes well for you.

Thank you guys so much! The vet is rabbit savvy, so hope we can get the right treatment. Will definately double check his hay though.
Just have two more questions- if it is bacterial, does that mean he will have to always be in isolation from the other two?
If I dampen his hay, will that affect his digestion at all? He seems to be eating and pooing fine.
So great to get all this fab advice.
Thanks:wave:

Forgot to say, I managed to post a photo in the stories section

Bobbybobtail said:

Thank you guys so much! The vet is rabbit savvy, so hope we can get the right treatment. Will definately double check his hay though.
Just have two more questions- if it is bacterial, does that mean he will have to always be in isolation from the other two?
If I dampen his hay, will that affect his digestion at all? He seems to be eating and pooing fine.
So great to get all this fab advice.
Thanks:wave:

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I'm so relieved to hear you've got a good rabbit vet. By far the majority are incredibly dedicated, & behind the scenes they can also get advice from the top rabbit vets in the country, when they hit problems.

No he won't always be in isolation from the other 2.
In theory snuffles should be highly infectious, but it's rare to hear of the partner bun getting the same infection on this forum, unless the bug is a staphylococcus aureus. It's a sensible precautionary step while we get levels of bacteria down with oral AB's, & see what we are dealing with.

No, damp hay won't affect his digestion, as long as it is completely changed every day. It mustn't get mouldy which takes several days. In fact I swirl the hay round & dry it out on a cake rack daily for my bun. It's less tasty that way. I reckon I've some experiments to do with a hoover & home made filters!!

My personal thoughts are that the main impact snuffles has on the gut is that rabbits have to breath through their noses.

If their nose is severely blocked with mucus they can't eat as much, particularly fiber. The fiber keeps the gut moving normally. If the gut slows down, (fewer poops, smaller poops, not eating their caecs (looks like smelly wet poops) they also get "wind" & pain, & this reduces their white blood cells & therefore their ability to fight bacterial infections, so the snuffles invades again, as well as having gut "stasis" issues. So in the future you'll be more vigilant if your bun is under any stress.

I suppose that the summary is:-
Stop the snuffles bacteria invading the nasal membrane.
AND get the mucus to drain quickly & Keep it draining to keep bacterial levels down to levels where they are harmless.

It's worth asking your vet whether some probiotic in your bun's water would be helpful. It's just a powder which encourages a healthy gut while they are taking Ab's for what ever reason. If it were my own bun, I'd have some in the house but only use it if there were early signs of gut issues, together with increasing fiber in the diet.

It sounds so scary at first. Honestly, when you live with your bun you get to know them & their ways. My own bun has dental/gut issues. I soon learned that when I heard him gulping his water to swallow, in HIS case it means he'll need a dental in the next 10 days. (Some buns are noisy drinkers anyway but he isn't) I've every confidence in you all that you'll get there.

Please keep us updated with his progress, & let us know what works for you.

You may find it useful to put a pinch of Bisolvin on his veg every day (available from your vet)...this helps to thin the snot and stop it blocking the airways.

I've always found it best to treat snuffles aggressively with antibiotics, otherwise it can progress and eventually will be much more difficult to treat.

Allergies aren't very common in rabbits, so I would always advise to treat for bacterial infection in the first instance.

Thank you guys again. I already give him pro c which the vet recommended. He is as lively as ever and I have been wiping his nose and paws with damp kitchen towel to stop the yucky stuff making him sore- I guess this is ok? The other 2 seem fine, but then they are very robust bunnies.
Will keep you posted.:wave:

Yes, it sounds good to keep him clean.
I've not heard of it used in buns, so please check it out. I wonder if a bit of vaseline, or even olive oil, gently massaged into the area which gets mucky, would make the muck easier to remove, & protect the skin from getting sore. They get fur loss & sore skin just with dribbling. He'll probably try to lick it off which is why I suggest checking it out.

Yes please keep us up to date.
With every good wish, & everything crossed for you all.