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Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 08:05 PM
Hiya :wave:

Beau doesn't seem right. He was fine this morning, absolutely normal, ate all his breakfast. Have come home and he kept trying to hide from us, wasn't keen on being stroked. Then he flopped out, but still didn't seem right, let me stroke him. He just let me pick him up, and only struggled a bit. His tummy feels quite spongey, do you think it might be wind? Shall I gave him Infacol? And if so, how much?

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 08:26 PM
Anyone?!

I've now given him some infacol (1ml) and about 1ml of water (he wouldn't take any more). He's flopped with his legs out behind him, but he still doesn't seem right :?

Jack's-Jane
05-02-2010, 08:30 PM
Is he eating,pooing,drinking and weeing ?
Is he breathing faster than normal ?
Do his ears feel very cold or very hot ?

Pie
05-02-2010, 08:32 PM
Hmm dont know what advice to give really... Just keep an eye on him tonight and try to keep him hydrated etc. Dont wasnt him overheating.
Im sure others will give better advice. Hope he is ok.

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 08:35 PM
Is he eating,pooing,drinking and weeing ?
Is he breathing faster than normal ?
Do his ears feel very cold or very hot ?

We've just given him a fresh litter tray so we can monitor output. We never see him drink. He hasn't eaten his dinner which was given about an hour ago.

His breathing seems quick, but then it always does, and I honestly couldn't tell you if it's faster than normal.

His ears feel a little cold.

Am so glad you've come along Jane, I looked for you but you didn't seem to be online.

Do we think vets? I'm happy to take him if necessary, just don't want to be paranoid or stress him out.

He's flopped again now, but he does seem to be pressing his tummy on the floor.

Jack's-Jane
05-02-2010, 08:42 PM
We've just given him a fresh litter tray so we can monitor output. We never see him drink. He hasn't eaten his dinner which was given about an hour ago.

His breathing seems quick, but then it always does, and I honestly couldn't tell you if it's faster than normal.

His ears feel a little cold.

Am so glad you've come along Jane, I looked for you but you didn't seem to be online.

Do we think vets? I'm happy to take him if necessary, just don't want to be paranoid or stress him out.

He's flopped again now, but he does seem to be pressing his tummy on the floor.


It sounds as though he has tummy pain and I would give the Vet a call if I were you. Catching a problem sooner rather than later is always the best option. Buns with tummy pain often breathe fast and they are not able to maintain their body temperature.

Sending vibes xx

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 08:43 PM
He also keeps occasionally making a noise like nails on a blackboard with his teeth *shivers*

He's just done a full on belly in the air type flop though! :love:

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 08:44 PM
It sounds as though he has tummy pain and I would give the Vet a call if I were you. Catching a problem sooner rather than later is always the best option. Buns with tummy pain often breathe fast and they are not able to maintain their body temperature.

Sending vibes xx

Will give them a ring. Will I be able to just chat to a vet though? I've never done it before.

What would likely treatment be?

Jack's-Jane
05-02-2010, 08:45 PM
He also keeps occasionally making a noise like nails on a blackboard with his teeth *shivers*

He's just done a full on belly in the air type flop though! :love:

Tooth grinding is a sign of severe pain :cry:

TBH I'd try to stop him flopping about too much. I'd pop him into a pet carrier with a heatpad and call the Vet.

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 08:53 PM
Tooth grinding is a sign of severe pain :cry:

TBH I'd try to stop him flopping about too much. I'd pop him into a pet carrier with a heatpad and call the Vet.

We don't have a heatpad. Have rung the emergency vet and they're gonna ring me back...

I feel sick. I have never had such a high-maintenance pet before. I just wanted a nice relaxing Friday night :roll:

donnamt
05-02-2010, 08:55 PM
oh no.. that sight of tummy pushing into the floor sends cold shivers down my spine.. sending loads of vibes for Beau xxx

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 09:04 PM
The vet said to give him some Zantac and has booked him in for 8:40am, said to ring back if he gets worse. Fat lot of good. :roll:

I've never seen him do the tummy pressing thing before, thats why I at first thought it was a regular flop, but I've never seen him do it so much, he does seem to want his tummy on the floor.

donnamt
05-02-2010, 09:09 PM
do you have metacam hun? it usually sorts alvins tummy out within a few hours.. its like magic juice, if not maybe the vet will let you pick some up tonight without upsetting Beau until the morning?

running about (against his will) gets the gas shifting for alvin as well..

i hate stasis/gas with a passion :evil::evil::evil:

Jack's-Jane
05-02-2010, 09:12 PM
I think I'd be insisting that the Vet sees him :?
He definately needs some pain relief aswell as Zantac.

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 09:13 PM
do you have metacam hun? it usually sorts alvins tummy out within a few hours.. its like magic juice, if not maybe the vet will let you pick some up tonight without upsetting Beau until the morning?

running about (against his will) gets the gas shifting for alvin as well..

i hate stasis/gas with a passion :evil::evil::evil:

We've got baytril zantac and infacol but no damn metacam. There's no1 at the vets surgery, so I suspect I would get charged the callout fee to get her to meet us there :? I nearly asked when we were on the phone before *kicks herself for not at least asking*

Seriously, what is it with buns?! And it always seemd to be the best loved ones who are the most fragile :roll:

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 09:15 PM
I think I'd be insisting that the Vet sees him :?
He definately needs some pain relief aswell as Zantac.

That's what concerned me, the vet asked what I had, and I said Zantac and Baytril, and she asked if I had metacam, and I said no, and she said not to worry. And I remembered your mantra of a bun in pain *needs* pain relief and it just didn't seem right. I don't trust my vet at all!

donnamt
05-02-2010, 09:20 PM
i will keep everything crossed the infacol and zantac works then..really hope you dont have to do an emergency vets dash tonight :(...

i swear bunnies just know when the vets are closed :evil: i had to be met at the vets once, i felt terrible but he was on call and i couldnt let Alvin get to the state he did when he had to be admitted :(

come on Beau hunny get that tummy moving xxxxx

VikkiVet
05-02-2010, 09:39 PM
You could try the Royal Vet College's Queen Mother Hospital - they run all the emergency and out of hours stuff around this area. They'll talk to you on the phone for sure and may let you have some metacam. bit of a drive for you but better than nothing?

bunny babe
05-02-2010, 09:45 PM
Sending Beau lots of vibes. Hope he is feeling better soon.

VickiP
05-02-2010, 09:46 PM
I had this not that long ago with Gizmo and was up all night with him but, he did get through it but, it was hard work. The only thing I think is important that he is not obstructed, I am surprised they didn't advise you over the phone how to check for that before adminstering anything. I was lucky in that it was gas, I don't even think it was bloat having looked at a bloated thread recently he wasn't distended thankfully.

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 09:53 PM
I had this not that long ago with Gizmo and was up all night with him but, he did get through it but, it was hard work. The only thing I think is important that he is not obstructed, I am surprised they didn't advise you over the phone how to check for that before adminstering anything. I was lucky in that it was gas, I don't even think it was bloat having looked at a bloated thread recently he wasn't distended thankfully.

Yeah it doesn't look like bloat, his tummy doesn't *look* round, it just feels spongey. He's just done a big wee, if that's of any interest to anyone? We can hear tummy noises.

Boudicca
05-02-2010, 09:56 PM
Awe no I hope he's ok! Daisy has bouts of stasis but a full blown episode is normally averted if you catch it early on Like Donna I normally give metacam followed by chasing around then after about and hour or so I tempt her with some fresh basil and parsley which normally works! The main thing is pain relief and fluids!! It's very difficult the first time it happens because youre not 100% sure what it is it's then easier to spot the signs! I hope this is a one off and he picks up soon!

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 09:59 PM
Awe no I hope he's ok! Daisy has bouts of stasis but a full blown episode is normally averted if you catch it early on Like Donna I normally give metacam followed by chasing around then after about and hour or so I tempt her with some fresh basil and parsley which normally works! The main thing is pain relief and fluids!! It's very difficult the first time it happens because youre not 100% sure what it is it's then easier to spot the signs! I hope this is a one off and he picks up soon!

He's had stasis several times before, and I still can't work out if that's what this is.

The one comforting thing about phoning the vet was that she obviously read his notes before ringing me, which I've never had before from this practice. :roll:

We've got him set up in our room for the night, litter tray, his favey towel, some food.

I just *wish* I had some metacam. If I could, I'd go get it from an allnight pharmac or something like that, but I won't pay a callout fee just to get some metacam, and not cos he isn't worth it, just because I think that would be an absolute con and a rip off!

VickiP
05-02-2010, 10:01 PM
Yeah it doesn't look like bloat, his tummy doesn't *look* round, it just feels spongey. He's just done a big wee, if that's of any interest to anyone? We can hear tummy noises.

Yep, Gizmo did a big wee on the sofa :roll: that's how I knew he deffo wasn't right, if his tummy is noisy it's moving and he is on the mend, keep him warm underneath, I put Gizmo in my fluffy dressing gown and put it round his sides but, not on top of him, I put a bunny buffet hay/dandelion mainly on a plate and a saucer of cooled but, still warm boiled water. I also put some fibreplex and mixed watery critical care on his paw and side of his mouth:oops: I figured it might work if he licked it at least and it was a miniscule amount, it did work not straight away, bit like us with trapped wind it can vary, keep him warm and let him rest but, encourage movement after an hour or so and gently (really really light pressure) rub not massage his tum in circular movements - avoid picking him up though just gently slide your hand under. Fingers crossed for the little man - it does sound very similar to what happened to Gizmo and I have no idea why it wasn't long after his spay I think and he was run down so it may have all been linked? Vibes for him and be prepared for a long haul, mine went on all night although didn't start till late, it could have been he bolted his dinner. Try and stay as calm as possible, I actually pretended to be asleep, reading the paper etc and didn't let him see me watching if you know what I mean;)

KarenM
05-02-2010, 10:03 PM
Oh no, not Beau now too. :( Sending lots of vibes. xx

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 10:03 PM
Yep, Gizmo did a big wee on the sofa :roll: that's how I knew he deffo wasn't right, if his tummy is noisy it's moving and he is on the mend, keep him warm underneath, I put Gizmo in my fluffy dressing gown and put it round his sides but, not on top of him, I put a bunny buffet hay/dandelion mainly on a plate and a saucer of cooled but, still warm boiled water. I also put some fibreplex and mixed watery critical care on his paw and side of his mouth:oops: I figured it might work if he licked it at least and it was a miniscule amount, it did work not straight away, bit like us with trapped wind it can vary, keep him warm and let him rest but, encourage movement after an hour or so and gently (really really light pressure) rub not massage his tum in circular movements - avoid picking him up though just gently slide your hand under. Fingers crossed for the little man - it does sound very similar to what happened to Gizmo and I have no idea why it wasn't long after his spay I think and he was run down so it may have all been linked? Vibes for him and be prepared for a long haul, mine went on all night although didn't start till late, it could have been he bolted his dinner. Try and stay as calm as possible, I actually pretended to be asleep, reading the paper etc and didn't let him see me watching if you know what I mean;)

I sooo know what you mean ;):lol: He keeps looking at me to see if I'm looking at him. And he's had a lovely hour and a half snuggled up on the bed getting rubs from me and OH, which I'm sure is sending totally the wrong message...worry mummy half to death and you get lots of cuddles!!

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 10:04 PM
Oh no, not Beau now too. :( Sending lots of vibes. xx

Maybe bunnies get the winter tummy bug too?! :? It does seem to be going around.

Jazzy B Bunny
05-02-2010, 10:07 PM
Get him to the vets NOW it sounds like what Jazzy had.. he went down hill and needed emergency surgery within half an hour... demand to be seen.

VickiP
05-02-2010, 10:08 PM
I sooo know what you mean ;):lol: He keeps looking at me to see if I'm looking at him. And he's had a lovely hour and a half snuggled up on the bed getting rubs from me and OH, which I'm sure is sending totally the wrong message...worry mummy half to death and you get lots of cuddles!!

:lol::lol: They do pick up vibes though I am sure, I honestly think if you panick they start to stress and think OMG whats wrong with me ! I do hope he will be alright, I did let him sleep for a couple of hours at one point, then encouraged a drink by putting it to him but, not forcing, then the hay etc just tickle his nose a bit in a couple of hours if he is still not eating. As I said it took a good while for me but, got there in the end and he was grand - I felt like a zombie :lol:

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 10:09 PM
Get him to the vets NOW it sounds like what Jazzy had.. he went down hill and needed emergency surgery within half an hour... demand to be seen.

BLIMEY!! :cry: do you really think so? What did Jazzy have? (sorry, I can't remember :oops: )

Jazzy B Bunny
05-02-2010, 10:10 PM
He had 'minor stasis' which turned in to bloat. :cry::cry: seriously, I'm not trying to scare you but I'd get to the vets.

Sending vibes xxx

Boudicca
05-02-2010, 10:10 PM
Gurgling is normally a good sign that things are on the move!! Did you give him any Zantac? Apart from reducing the stomach acids in an empty tum it helps get the lower gut moving! If the gas isn't in his tummy then the infacol should help the smaller bubbles join together and pass easier through his system! SarahP also swears by warm peppermint tea!! Think this is gonna be a long night for you!!

VickiP
05-02-2010, 10:12 PM
BLIMEY!! :cry: do you really think so? What did Jazzy have? (sorry, I can't remember :oops: )

Yes don't let me put you off Lib if you think he needs the vet then go for it. Just sharing what happened with Gizmo, only you can decide whats best in the end for your bunny though. I am sharing that with you as the vet you spoke to read his history and didn't seem overly concerned. x

donnamt
05-02-2010, 10:12 PM
my vet suggested *possibly* the change in temp outside is what bought Alvins last stasis on. she reakons he must of snuggled up to keep warm and his gut just slowed right down... sounds as likely as any other theory ive been through and the weather is so up and down right now :evil:

another vet said some bunnies are just prone, like humans with iffy guts... so hopefully by tomorrow Beau will be on his way to recovery and youll have a bottle of miracle juice ready for the next time.

i have found though the later i leave pain relief the longer Alvin takes to bounce back, so you may be in for a few days of hell again :(

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 10:12 PM
Gurgling is normally a good sign that things are on the move!! Did you give him any Zantac? Apart from reducing the stomach acids in an empty tum it helps get the lower gut moving! If the gas isn't in his tummy then the infacol should help the smaller bubbles join together and pass easier through his system! SarahP also swears by warm peppermint tea!! Think this is gonna be a long night for you!!

He's had 1ml of infacol and 0.6ml of Zantac.

I really don't know what to do now, emergency vet or not... :?

Jazzy B Bunny
05-02-2010, 10:13 PM
yes, its only what i'd do because i'm totally paranoid now :cry:

VickiP
05-02-2010, 10:18 PM
He's had 1ml of infacol and 0.6ml of Zantac.

I really don't know what to do now, emergency vet or not... :?

It is hard, but, you have to decide, you know him the best. Gizmo got through an episode which sounds very similar with no meds but, as we know they are all different. Also I had been around all day with him so I roughly knew how long since he'd eaten, pooped etc you need to take that into account aswell. It was a good couple of hours from the long wee and the gurgling before he started eating in my case, he lapped some water first aswell then moved onto the hay and dandelion, I am so glad I had his fave's in then though.

donnamt
05-02-2010, 10:22 PM
if i didnt have pain relief at home i personally wouldnt wait more than a couple of hours to go to the vets.. ive had too many close calls with Alvin to risk him. but if you think Beau will be ok hun dont panic, just get him moving and keep on with the infacol and making him run about... i try to get 10ml of water in every few hours until Alvin eats.. but its really hard work :oops:

annoy him with food till he takes it in a tantrum too.. Alvin will eat just so i dont grab him to put water in

KarenM
05-02-2010, 10:23 PM
I really don't know what to do now, emergency vet or not... :?

Only you can decide. :) It's so hard to call it, especially as none of us are there. Jazzy turned out to be really ill, while Alfie made a miraculous recovery as soon as I parted with my cash at the vets. :roll::lol:

What time did you get in? Just wondering how long Beau's definitely been like this, but bear in mind too that you don't know how long he was quiet for before you came home.

Boudicca
05-02-2010, 10:25 PM
He's had 1ml of infacol and 0.6ml of Zantac.

I really don't know what to do now, emergency vet or not... :?

It's a tricky one if he's had stasis before you know how quickly or otherwise he can go downhill?! I guess the emergency vet will feel his tummy to check for a blockage or bloat, give painkiller and gut stimulant and send you home with some critical care food to syringe for about 150!! It's so difficult without painkiller as I would try that first and if no change within 2-3hrs Id go to the vet! Have you tried chasing him around! I know it's horrible and all you want to do is keep him snuggled up but if his condition doesn't improve after trying everything then I would take him to get painkiller! Are their no RU members near you who might have some metacam?! I might try syringing some more warm boiled water as well!

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 10:25 PM
Only you can decide. :) It's so hard to call it, especially as none of us are there. Jazzy turned out to be really ill, while Alfie made a miraculous recovery as soon as I parted with my cash at the vets. :roll::lol:

What time did you get in? Just wondering how long Beau's definitely been like this, but bear in mind too that you don't know how long he was quiet for before you came home.

We got in about 7:30, so only 3 hours I guess. :?

Jazzy B Bunny
05-02-2010, 10:26 PM
We got in about 7:30, so only 3 hours I guess. :?

Its your call, I personally would be straight up the vets.

I've seen how fast they can go down hill :cry:

Vibes xxxx

VickiP
05-02-2010, 10:27 PM
We got in about 7:30, so only 3 hours I guess. :?

What's your instinct telling you?

antigone
05-02-2010, 10:30 PM
Sending lots of vibes xxxxx

Bundinki
05-02-2010, 10:35 PM
Sending lots of vibes, really hoping the ranitidine & infacol help.

Do you have any critical care? Could you give him a bit to see if that helps also?

Also another idea, does sound gross but what about caecotrophs from another "healthy" bun mashed up with some water & syringe fed ? Sounds gross but has worked for me on several occasions where my buns have had tummy probs not something that is proven and has mixed opinions, but I's maybe give it a go

XX

Lib_n_bunny
05-02-2010, 10:40 PM
What's your instinct telling you?

I think go to the vet, but OH thinks not. His point is every time we've been to the vet they've done little more than take my money (and large amounts of it at that). Even over 3 days last time the vet was unable to help him, until finally we took him to a local rescue lady, and she got him going with 20ml critical care and an injection of metoclopramide. Literally within minutes he was eating again :roll:

I keep saying to OH if we didn't do anything and something happens we'd never forgive ourselves. He keeps saying it's 50:50 and could go either way, we've previously gone down the vet route and it hasn't worked, so maybe patience and not getting him stressed might help.

Thanks everyone for the vibes :)

VickiP
05-02-2010, 10:44 PM
I think go to the vet, but OH thinks not. His point is every time we've been to the vet they've done little more than take my money (and large amounts of it at that). Even over 3 days last time the vet was unable to help him, until finally we took him to a local rescue lady, and she got him going with 20ml critical care and an injection of metoclopramide. Literally within minutes he was eating again :roll:

I keep saying to OH if we didn't do anything and something happens we'd never forgive ourselves. He keeps saying it's 50:50 and could go either way, we've previously gone down the vet route and it hasn't worked, so maybe patience and not getting him stressed might help.

Thanks everyone for the vibes :)

Yes I see your dilemma, it's a tough one, it makes you wonder how these little things stuck at the bottom of the garden get on when they are probably locked up for the night ages ago? It is a tough choice and as I said your the only one with your OH who can decide, you can see him, you know him etc etc I do hope he will perk up for you or that the vet will sort him-whichever way you go I hope it works out well xx

Bundinki
05-02-2010, 10:45 PM
I know it's getting late, but could you try the local rescue lady ?

Boudicca
06-02-2010, 07:26 AM
How is Beau this morning? Did he pick up through the night and start eating?

LloydFerris
06-02-2010, 08:03 AM
Anxiously awaiting news.....
I just saw this thread and am worried for your little one as well. Vibes are coming from Canada, too!

Lib_n_bunny
06-02-2010, 08:17 AM
Well, it took until about 2am, but he finally started eating!! So we went to sleep, have just woken up to all his food gone and poo EVERYWHERE :D:D:D He's been binkying around and being a right mischief! :roll: :love::love::love:

Thanks for all the vibes, advice and concern, you guys are awesome :D:love:

KarenM
06-02-2010, 08:30 AM
Phew, that's great news. :D:D

bunny babe
06-02-2010, 08:35 AM
:wave: Great news - don't we all just love poop. :lol::lol::lol:

Boudicca
06-02-2010, 09:15 AM
Yay that's great news :D what a relief! Think if I were you Id defo go and get an emergency bottle of metacam just incase he decides to have another little episode at some point coz you know it always happens out of hours :lol:

donnamt
06-02-2010, 10:30 AM
great news :D:D

antigone
06-02-2010, 02:05 PM
Great news! :D

VickiP
06-02-2010, 03:03 PM
Well, it took until about 2am, but he finally started eating!! So we went to sleep, have just woken up to all his food gone and poo EVERYWHERE :D:D:D He's been binkying around and being a right mischief! :roll: :love::love::love:

Thanks for all the vibes, advice and concern, you guys are awesome :D:love:

Awwww so delighted to hear that, that's great :love::love: