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View Full Version : Strange symptoms? Any ideas?



chloaster
28-02-2009, 09:03 AM
About 10days ago Apache had a damp nose, no snot just wet so he was given 7days baytril, there was no improvement so we went to the vet and we noticed that his face looked a bit droopy on one side but apart from that there were no other physical signs he was ill, just a bit dribbly, so I brought him home.

On wednesday I noticed his eye was a little weepy, on the side of the face that's ok, so this friday we went back to see the vet - the sum of his symptoms now are that the right side of his face has drooped further (Bells palsy type thing) his left eye is watery, no pus, but his ear glands (?) are very swollen. The vets have put him on metacam and baytril over the weekend, hoping it is an infection or inflammation, and if there is no sign of improvement he is going to have x-rays at the beginning of next week ....

But this am he was a bit wobbly on his feet - am I being dramatic thinking this is really not good and there could be something very worrying going on in his head? The biggest concern I have is that, whilst he is eating and pooping fine, he is very subdued :cry:

Jack's-Jane
28-02-2009, 09:28 AM
It sounds like a middle ear problem to me.
My Bernie Bunny has had the exact same symptoms. A skull Xray is the only way to diagnose the problem fully.
Personally I'd want Bun on more heavy duty abx by injection from today as his symptoms are worsening despite Baytril. I'd want Bun on a high dose of Metacam too-up to 0.3mg/kg every 12 hours. I'd also start Panacur to 'cover all bases'.

Here is Bernie and her wonky face

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b27/Jan-bun/Rabbits2/001-11.jpg

Sending lots of get well vibes for him

xx

ETA Vibes for your poorly keyboard too..........

chloaster
28-02-2009, 09:38 AM
ETA Vibes for your poorly keyboard too..........

:lol: Thank you!

And thank you for the re-assurance. :love: My head was going down the tumour route and all sorts! :oops: I'm in work but going to ring the vets as soon as they open and have a chat with them and see if they will prescribe something heavier for him as Andy can pick up for me or whether they want him in today.

bunlover
28-02-2009, 10:57 AM
my first thoughts were also middle ear infection so i hope it can be treated effectivly lots of vibes xxx

chloaster
28-02-2009, 11:38 AM
my first thoughts were also middle ear infection so i hope it can be treated effectivly lots of vibes xxx

Thank you :love:

Sooz
28-02-2009, 07:23 PM
It sounds like a middle ear problem to me.
My Bernie Bunny has had the exact same symptoms. A skull Xray is the only way to diagnose the problem fully.
Personally I'd want Bun on more heavy duty abx by injection from today as his symptoms are worsening despite Baytril. I'd want Bun on a high dose of Metacam too-up to 0.3mg/kg every 12 hours. I'd also start Panacur to 'cover all bases'.

Here is Bernie and her wonky face

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b27/Jan-bun/Rabbits2/001-11.jpg

Sending lots of get well vibes for him

xx

ETA Vibes for your poorly keyboard too..........

Lexie looks just like this too, she developed a droop about 8 months ago now and though all her other symptoms cleared up her face never went back to normal. She also shook her ears alot at the time, which indicated an ear problem.

I'd never seen or heard of it in another rabbit before now.

Jack's-Jane
28-02-2009, 07:27 PM
Lexie looks just like this too, she developed a droop about 8 months ago now and though all her other symptoms cleared up her face never went back to normal. She also shook her ears alot at the time, which indicated an ear problem.

I'd never seen or heard of it in another rabbit before now.

Bernie has a permanent wonky face now. She has had more middle ear infections than I care to remember :cry:

chloaster
28-02-2009, 07:31 PM
Lexie looks just like this too, she developed a droop about 8 months ago now and though all her other symptoms cleared up her face never went back to normal. She also shook her ears alot at the time, which indicated an ear problem.

I'd never seen or heard of it in another rabbit before now.

What other symptoms did she have Sooz? I am feeling encouraged as Apache was shaking his head this am which is what knocked him off balance initially .... starting to hope it's not a tumour now!! :oops: He has ceperex to tide him over til monday now when he is going back in to see my regular vet .... typical isn't it? He saw two vets yesterday and both are off shift today! :roll:

Sooz
28-02-2009, 07:42 PM
What other symptoms did she have Sooz? I am feeling encouraged as Apache was shaking his head this am which is what knocked him off balance initially .... starting to hope it's not a tumour now!! :oops: He has ceperex to tide him over til monday now when he is going back in to see my regular vet .... typical isn't it? He saw two vets yesterday and both are off shift today! :roll:

Well she has always had eye problems and her remaining eye streamed pretty continuously, and she would just flick her head so both ears would jump up in the air a few times, she did it quite frequently. She also has chronic Pasteurella related 'snuffles'. I didn't notice any balance problems personally.

Everything bar the droop has cleared up on the Oxytet' injections.

This is going to sound silly but I can't really work out which side of her face is the 'normal' one, just that it's wonky, the vets thought the problem was the opposite side to me. :?

Phoebesmummy9
28-02-2009, 07:48 PM
Have you considered, the fact bunny may of had a stroke?

Sooz
28-02-2009, 07:56 PM
Have you considered, the fact bunny may of had a stroke?

We thought this was what had caused Lexie's droop at first, but it didn't fit with her other symptoms. An ear infection made far more sense.

chloaster
28-02-2009, 09:06 PM
Similar to Sooz really - the symptoms seem to have progressively come on - first it was the runny nose and slight droop, then the runny eye and worse droop, then the swollen glands and aparent inbalance.

chloaster
28-02-2009, 09:12 PM
Apache - again similar to Sooz - I look at him and wonder if it is the right side that's drooped or rather the left pulled tight as the problems are all on the left - ie snotty nose and wet eye ......

http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm300/fat-fluffs/CIMG0243.jpg

Jack's-Jane
28-02-2009, 09:41 PM
Apache - again similar to Sooz - I look at him and wonder if it is the right side that's drooped or rather the left pulled tight as the problems are all on the left - ie snotty nose and wet eye ......

http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm300/fat-fluffs/CIMG0243.jpg

I'd put money on the origin of the problem being elongated tooth roots.
I hope the Ceporex gets the infection under control.

chloaster
28-02-2009, 09:45 PM
I'd put money on the origin of the problem being elongated tooth roots.


Hopefully the x-ray next week will show if there is a problem there - thanks for all the support and advice guys :D

Happy Hopping
01-03-2009, 10:11 AM
Have you considered, the fact bunny may of had a stroke?

See, that's what I was thinking when I read the 1st post. In human, when say the face area has no feeling and the muscle becomes non-responsive, it's a symptom of stroke.

Sooz
01-03-2009, 10:53 AM
I forgot to say with Lexie, I also thought at first that perhaps the droop had been the result of some nerve damage when her left eye was removed....as this is the side that is lower. However she had her eye taken out at a year old and was 4 when this droop developed so it seems entirely unlikely.

Her nose & eye problems were to the right and this is the side that had lifted.

chloaster
01-03-2009, 11:09 AM
See, that's what I was thinking when I read the 1st post. In human, when say the face area has no feeling and the muscle becomes non-responsive, it's a symptom of stroke.

So if it is possibly a stroke are the swollen ear glands a symptom and why does he have the watery eye and nose on the non-droopy side?

I did find this which is obviously to do with humans but interesting none the less - "The symptoms of Bell's palsy are likely to come on very quickly - often in a matter of hours or overnight. The main symptom is likely to be paralysis or weakness on one side of the face, along with a sagging eyebrow and difficulty closing the eye. Mild earache or pain behind the ear is sometimes the first sign of Bell's palsy." http://hcd2.bupa.co.uk/fact_sheets/html/bells_palsy.html

raine
01-03-2009, 12:19 PM
My Daisy has a very nasty lower ear infection. She weighs 3.8 and has been on 3 mls of Baytril, half a metrodiazole twice a day, 0.6 metacam. Because of the severity, we appear to be just holding her situation rather than "curing" it. She is under Bristol Vet Hospital. She also is on tear drops four times a day.

Should have said, we did x-rays to determine the ear infection. She was also negative for EC.

Jack's-Jane
01-03-2009, 01:04 PM
So if it is possibly a stroke are the swollen ear glands a symptom and why does he have the watery eye and nose on the non-droopy side?

I do not believe it to be a CVA. If it were there would probably be other neurological symptoms.
Everything fits perfectly with Otitis Media and as Raine has found with her Bun sometimes a full cure is not possible, its more a case of getting the infection under control and minimising pain and inflammation.

Surgery is an option but it is major and may not be successful

http://wildlife1.wildlifeinformation.org/S/00Man/VeterinaryTechniques/Indiv_TechniquesRabbit/Bulla_osteotomy_Rabbit.htm

http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&A=1708&S=1

Whilst my Bernie Bunny does recover from her middle ear infections they do recur and over time they have caused damage to the facial nerves and perforation of the eardrum.

chloaster
01-03-2009, 07:02 PM
Surgery is an option but it is major and may not be successful


Don't like the sound of that! "There is a high risk of post-operative complications."

Jack's-Jane
01-03-2009, 07:19 PM
Don't like the sound of that! "There is a high risk of post-operative complications."

Thats one of the reasons why I opted not to put Bernie through it. That and the fact that she struggles under GAs at the best of times.

ecudc
01-03-2009, 08:06 PM
oh dear he definately looks worse than when I last saw him.....hopefully it is the ear infection after seeing Janes photo it certainly looks more likely especially if he has snotty nose. I always get ear infections when I get a cold :oops:

chloaster
02-03-2009, 12:45 PM
Well this am his nose was still damp but not as bad and his eye was almost dry!! :D His ear glands are still very swollen and his face still wonky but he is with the vets now and I am waiting to hear from them. :)

Jack's-Jane
02-03-2009, 12:47 PM
Well this am his nose was still damp but not as bad and his eye was almost dry!! :D His ear glands are still very swollen and his face still wonky but he is with the vets now and I am waiting to hear from them. :)

Fingers crossed that the abx are starting to kick in. It sounds as though they are :)

raine
02-03-2009, 03:03 PM
Glad there is some improvement. Daisy never lost her wonky face, some do and some not, so dont be too worried if it stays.

chloaster
02-03-2009, 03:12 PM
Thanks guys - Just rung and they've been so busy they haven't got round to him yet ..... Got to call back about 16:00 ..........

Jack's-Jane
02-03-2009, 03:43 PM
Thanks guys - Just rung and they've been so busy they haven't got round to him yet ..... Got to call back about 16:00 ..........


Gaaaaaaaah, I hate it when that happens !!
Still sending vibes :)

maxbun
02-03-2009, 06:16 PM
Hope you get good news from the vets. Lynx sends snuggles to Apache!
Jane

ecudc
02-03-2009, 10:18 PM
chloes gone to work now but I'm sure will be on in between planes. I popped in to say hello today & appache looks quite a bit better snot & eye wise although he's still lopsided & under his both ears are lumps about the size of malteasers. I'm guessing that they have a lymph node in those locations?

JoJoWoz
02-03-2009, 10:18 PM
:wave: only just caught this thread and we were wondering if there is any news on Apache?
Thinking of you both.

chloaster
03-03-2009, 12:17 AM
Sorry - between planes! - the vets decided that, as he was responding well to the abx, not to go ahead with the xrays just yet and to give him another 5days of Ceperex and see how he goes; the main concern at the moment is the swollen glands. They are also are thinking along the lines of doing blood tests when he's finsihed the course of abx before putting him under GA for the xray just to make sure there is nothing there. He has seemed brighter today and he tucked straight into his apple braches when he got home so I am hoping he will continue to improve this week and take it from there.

Woodlouse
03-03-2009, 12:19 AM
Glad to hear he's a little brighter - been thinking of you all x