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View Full Version : Please send vibes - Bambi now :-( U/D Blood results are back may not be good :-(



BirdieBun
16-12-2008, 09:48 AM
I am seriously fed up :cry:

2 weeks ago I lost Britney due to an impactation and her stomach lining had turned black........

Then Sunday Poppet died in my arms but he wasn't poorly I can only assume old age as he was 100% fine the day before :cry:

Now Bambi I noticed on Saturday appeared to have lost a bit of weight.....she had to stay at the vets overnight so they can blood test her today to see if her kidneys and liver are functioning ok.......and to see if she is possibly diabetic :(

I just hope more than anything they all come back clear and it is just a case of feeding her up.........the vet couldn't feel anythign abnormal, her teeth look fine and her body temperature was spot on.

I can't bear the thought of anything being wrong with Mrs she's my baby :cry::cry:

I am concerned that it is her that is over grooming Bessie (police REW) as Bessie had to go to the vets last week as she is bald on her back, but it is the bunnies over grooming her - I am wondering if Bambi has been swallowing all Bessie's fur - however she is eating and isn't bloated she has just lost weight......anyway please send vibes to my gorgeous girl :love:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y10/birdiebun/080807045-1.jpg

Denny
16-12-2008, 09:51 AM
sending tons and tons of vibes to bambi and you Carys, fingers, toes and paws all crossed my end for you both xxx

Bavarian Bunny
16-12-2008, 09:51 AM
Oh no, poor you. :( I hadn't even seen that you lost Poppet. So sorry. :(

Lots of vibes for Bambi, I hope it's nothing serious.

FudgeMallow
16-12-2008, 09:52 AM
Sending lots and lots of vibes from me and the bunnies
:love::love::love::love:

Maizey
16-12-2008, 09:56 AM
Sending mega vibes Bambi's way and a big hug for you Cary's

BirdieBun
16-12-2008, 09:58 AM
Thank you all xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

sally1974
16-12-2008, 09:59 AM
sending millions of vibes for Bambi, and lots of cuddles for you Cary's
Sallyx

bunny babe
16-12-2008, 10:05 AM
So sorry to hear about your losses. Sending mega vibes to Bambi (very pretty). Hope the results are OK.

BirdieBun
16-12-2008, 10:06 AM
Thank you guys x x x x

March Hare
16-12-2008, 10:10 AM
Sending tons of vibes to the gorgeous Bambi. xxxxx

((((((((((((((( VIBES )))))))))))))))

Becca
16-12-2008, 10:13 AM
Sending lots of vibes.

BirdieBun
16-12-2008, 10:22 AM
Awwww thank you all xxxxxxxxxx

Jack's-Jane
16-12-2008, 10:29 AM
I hope that all the tests are clear.
Sending tons of vibes :)

Snowy
16-12-2008, 10:29 AM
Sending you loads of vibes, I am sorry to hear you are having such a tough time

BirdieBun
16-12-2008, 10:35 AM
Thank you all these vibes mean so much x

Happy Hopping
16-12-2008, 10:38 AM
How old is Poppet? As I must have missed that thread.

To fix the grooming problem, all you need is to wet your hand, to run it along the back of the bun, as the fur tangles all over your hand, you dip your hand (w/ fur) to a big bowl of water.

You do the above a no. of times daily, so you essentially help your bun to shed his fur, that way when your other bun try to groom her partner, there isn't much fur to groom. As such, not much fur goes to the stomach.

Lots of healing vibes to your little Bambi.

BirdieBun
16-12-2008, 10:41 AM
Poppet was around 7 bless him :cry:

They are overgrooming her as in pulling her fur out she is bald on her back! :roll: Not as in she moults and they lick the loose fur :)

Angie65
16-12-2008, 10:45 AM
Poppet was around 7 bless him :cry:

They are overgrooming her as in pulling her fur out she is bald on her back! :roll: Not as in she moults and they lick the loose fur :)

My NZ looks like that too - but there's only Suki who can be doing it to him & she'd have to climb on his back to reach:?

Hope Bambi is ok. We never found out the cause of Alfie's weight loss second time round - he had blood tests for kidneys & EC, but all results were clear. He's kept his weight on this time round but I am still seriously overfeeding on pellets:?

Lucy
16-12-2008, 10:47 AM
Awww hope she's ok, she is a stunning looking bun :love:

BirdieBun
16-12-2008, 10:51 AM
My NZ looks like that too - but there's only Suki who can be doing it to him & she'd have to climb on his back to reach:?

Hope Bambi is ok. We never found out the cause of Alfie's weight loss second time round - he had blood tests for kidneys & EC, but all results were clear. He's kept his weight on this time round but I am still seriously overfeeding on pellets:?


Yeh same cos my REW is hugeeeeeee and lives with 2 teeny buns and Bambi so they must climb up onto her to do it :roll:

Thanks Lucy :love:

NicolaB18
16-12-2008, 11:51 AM
lots n lots n lots of vibes coming ur way for mrs! xxxxxxxxx

Phill
16-12-2008, 12:07 PM
Sending loads of vibes hun xxxx

Fran
16-12-2008, 12:21 PM
Sending loads of vibes xx

KarenM
16-12-2008, 12:26 PM
I'm so sorry to hear Bambi is poorly; you must be so worried. Sending lots of vibes for the little sweetie. :love::love:

animal ry
16-12-2008, 12:38 PM
:wave::D:):pHUGS!!!!!!!!and VIBES!!!!!!!!!!!!!! to you and her!!!!!:love::wave::D:)

BirdieBun
16-12-2008, 12:41 PM
Well the vets just called, they have done her blood test, she has a high glucose level and also one high enzyme level in her liver - they are sending away her blood samples to the lab now so analysis as the vet said they cant base glucose levels on one test as it can alter depending on what they have eaten and their stress levels etc.

So basically they want to make sure her liver does not have a primary disease and if it is diabetets that it is only diabetes that they are treating rather than them treating something when there is an underlying problem with her liver.

So I got to collect her tonight and feed her up on lots of veg hay pellets and I am going to give her porrridge too.

She weighed 2.76kg in Feb 2007 and today she weighs 1.56kg :shock:

I hope I have made sense and if anybody understands all of this could I have your thougths please as it all is so confusing to me :shock:

Jack's-Jane
16-12-2008, 12:53 PM
Well the vets just called, they have done her blood test, she has a high glucose level and also one high enzyme level in her liver - they are sending away her blood samples to the lab now so analysis as the vet said they cant base glucose levels on one test as it can alter depending on what they have eaten and their stress levels etc.

So basically they want to make sure her liver does not have a primary disease and if it is diabetets that it is only diabetes that they are treating rather than them treating something when there is an underlying problem with her liver.

So I got to collect her tonight and feed her up on lots of veg hay pellets and I am going to give her porrridge too.

She weighed 2.76kg in Feb 2007 and today she weighs 1.56kg :shock:

I hope I have made sense and if anybody understands all of this could I have your thougths please as it all is so confusing to me :shock:

Diabetes is very rare in Buns. Without knowing what Liver enzyme was abnormal I cant really make any suggestions :? The fuller screening will give the Vet a better picture of what might be going on.
If Bambi is in a group she may need to be fed seperately to make sure she gets her share of things. She may also benefit from being indoors as she wont want to be burning off calories to keep herself warm. She needs all her energy intake to build herself up.

Milk Thistle is very helpful for Liver problems. Maybe you could ask the Vet about it?

http://www.natural-alternative-products.co.uk/natures-answer-alcohol-free-milk-thistle-drops-30ml-p-1667.html

BirdieBun
16-12-2008, 02:11 PM
Awwww Jane thank you well they said we should get the results in 3 days so as soon as they are in the vet will ring me with a course of action, I think as it stands she is at a loss until she gets definite answers.

I dont really know about keeping her indoors as she lives in a group of 4 so I will bring her in for food to feed her extra bits and bobs but she is eating alot and has eaten all her food at the vets over night.

I have just been and brought a huge bag of straw so I can make their bed extra cosy and I am going to feed her sooooooo much she is going to be so full bless her.

I am thinking some porridge - what else is good and fattening? We have some barley rings on order too as I knwo they are fattening :)

P.s The link doesn't work Jane :wave:

Denny
16-12-2008, 02:59 PM
what else is good and fattening?


sunflower seeds, alfapha hay, oat hay,:D good luck Carys and Bambi, I hope all is nothing to worry about and that it is something simple to cure:D

BirdieBun
16-12-2008, 03:43 PM
Thanks Denny x x :wave:

bunlover
16-12-2008, 03:43 PM
vibes

bluebunny
16-12-2008, 04:54 PM
Hope shes ok xxxx

luvabun
16-12-2008, 05:53 PM
:( Oh Carys what a horrid time you're having. Sincerely hope she's OK.

BirdieBun
17-12-2008, 10:17 AM
Thank you....well she came home last night and I had her in the house for a bit giving her veg and making sure she ate a fair bit of it before putting her out, I then out that much straw in their house you coudlnt see any of the bunnies :lol::lol:

I am so glad she is home I am going to feed her some porridge at lunchtime and stuff some more straw in and just enjoy her whilst we wait for the results from the lab :love:

Happy Hopping
17-12-2008, 10:51 AM
what else is good and fattening? We have some barley rings on order too as I knwo they are fattening :)

corn on the cob

BirdieBun
22-12-2008, 10:27 AM
Okay well my vet rang me on Saturday morning with Bambi Liver analysis results. She said Bambi has 1 of 2 things, its either Liver cancer (she said she cannot feel it though but it does not rule it out) or a parasite which is usually present in the intestine but can attack the liver. She has ordered me in a drug called Septram (sp) which should be there today so I can start the treatment for the parasite, if there is no improvement it is cancer - she is so thin its awful and yet she is eating so much its really hard to see her this thin :cry::cry:

Does anybody have a similar experience that we are going through?

AlisonA
22-12-2008, 11:03 AM
Oh dear, sorry things aren't looking better :? She might be talking about hepatic coccidiosis as that has an intestinal and hepatic form and septrin can be used to treat it - I must admit it's something that I thought when I just read the start of the thread :?

It might be worth getting a fecal sample sent off for analysis - although I have known coccidiosis to show negative in fecal samples even where that turned out to be the diagnosis, so don't 100% rely on the results. There are also other specific anti-coccidia drugs that can be used and might be more effective, I have also known oral maxolon be used in conjunction, to help the guts keep moving along and that seems to have worked well in some cases.

If this is the reason she's giving you septrin I would also suggest that all the bunnies should be being treated as coccidia is really infectious, so I think it's worth you checking what your vet is suspecting.

Again, if it is that, there are a couple of really key things you can do to minimise her reinfection and help prevent its spread to others. Firstly, it is spread through infected poop, and the spores become infective 48 hours after the poop has been pooped, so you need to thoroughly clean out all the buns every day, and take particular care to make sure that every single one is scooped out and not a single one drops out and rolls away. Then you need to thoroughly disinfect - coccidia spores are really resistant, so you can either use boiling water/steam clean or jeyes fluid. It goes without saying that in both cases the bunnies need to be well clear until the smell has gone (jeyes) and their house is dry again. Don't let them out onto any areas that can't be treated like this, e.g. grass, soil, carpet etc. Also I would keep hay in racks and food in bowls as far as possible for now, just to minimise the risk of faecal contamination getting onto the food.

I really hope this isn't what you are dealing with, as it is a very nasty disease which spreads very easily (incubation is about a fortnight-3 weeks I think so do keep an eye on all the others) and the prognosis for the hepatic form is not great, it attacks the bile ducts so can cause irrepairable damage and buns can start to look as if they are recovering from the initial infection but then go downhill again because of damage to the liver. I sincerely hope I'm wrong :cry: Best wishes xxx

BirdieBun
22-12-2008, 11:23 AM
OMG Alison!!!! Well I asked her whether what she said was contagious she said no............I had a bad signal when I spoke to her so I didn't catch the exact thing she called it - OMG!!!!!!! I am so worried now........I will ring to speak to the vet after lunch as the septrum should be in by then - I really hope it isn't what you are saying too Alison :cry: All my other bunnies seem fine though as does Bambi in herself...............she has been a big drinker for months though but I just felt it was normal for her as some bunnies drink more than others :cry:

Jack's-Jane
22-12-2008, 11:27 AM
Oh dear, sorry things aren't looking better :? She might be talking about hepatic coccidiosis as that has an intestinal and hepatic form and septrin can be used to treat it - I must admit it's something that I thought when I just read the start of the thread :?

It might be worth getting a fecal sample sent off for analysis - although I have known coccidiosis to show negative in fecal samples even where that turned out to be the diagnosis, so don't 100% rely on the results. There are also other specific anti-coccidia drugs that can be used and might be more effective, I have also known oral maxolon be used in conjunction, to help the guts keep moving along and that seems to have worked well in some cases.

If this is the reason she's giving you septrin I would also suggest that all the bunnies should be being treated as coccidia is really infectious, so I think it's worth you checking what your vet is suspecting.

Again, if it is that, there are a couple of really key things you can do to minimise her reinfection and help prevent its spread to others. Firstly, it is spread through infected poop, and the spores become infective 48 hours after the poop has been pooped, so you need to thoroughly clean out all the buns every day, and take particular care to make sure that every single one is scooped out and not a single one drops out and rolls away. Then you need to thoroughly disinfect - coccidia spores are really resistant, so you can either use boiling water/steam clean or jeyes fluid. It goes without saying that in both cases the bunnies need to be well clear until the smell has gone (jeyes) and their house is dry again. Don't let them out onto any areas that can't be treated like this, e.g. grass, soil, carpet etc. Also I would keep hay in racks and food in bowls as far as possible for now, just to minimise the risk of faecal contamination getting onto the food.

I really hope this isn't what you are dealing with, as it is a very nasty disease which spreads very easily (incubation is about a fortnight-3 weeks I think so do keep an eye on all the others) and the prognosis for the hepatic form is not great, it attacks the bile ducts so can cause irrepairable damage and buns can start to look as if they are recovering from the initial infection but then go downhill again because of damage to the liver. I sincerely hope I'm wrong :cry: Best wishes xxx

Excellent post Alison.

Carys I am so sorry to hear that Bambi's test results were not more encouraging :cry: I totally agree with Alison re asking your Vet about treatment for all your Buns if Vet suspects Coccidiosis.

http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/171332.htm

http://en.allexperts.com/q/Rabbits-703/2008/12/Hepatic-Coccidiosis.htm

Sending tons of vibes

AlisonA
22-12-2008, 11:27 AM
I really hope I'm wrong and that's not what she's suspecting at all, but for now at least I would 'assume the worst' as at least that way you will be helping to limit its spread if it does turn out to be that :(

Really hope everything is ok xxx

BirdieBun
22-12-2008, 11:36 AM
I am so scared now I am waiting for my vet to ring me back......Bambi's poo's are normal she is eating and drinking and her only visable symtom is weight loss.........wouldn't another bunny show signs if it was this? I think I should wait until my vet calls back as now I am so worried - I appreciate what you have put here Alison to make me aware.......if it was this are all bunnies at risk or just the bunnies that live with Bambi? I will wait for the vet to call me if she does say this I am going to be heartbroken cos I know I will lose all my bunnies :cry:

Britney lived with Bambi she had weight loss but when she was opened up it was an impactation which had turned the lining of her stomach black - this would not be a symptom of this?

bluebunny
22-12-2008, 11:49 AM
Have you heard from the vets yet? Hope shes ok xx

BirdieBun
22-12-2008, 12:00 PM
Not yet they will probably ring me after this morning's surgery x

AlisonA
22-12-2008, 12:06 PM
Awww hun, no wonder you're so worried :( If when you speak to her she does think it's a possibility, I would absolutely want ALL bunnies to be treated, whether they are in contact with Bambi or not. This is particularly true if the buns are outdoors (because it only takes a bit of wind to blow some infected bedding around, for example) or share exercise spaces.

The treatments don't actually 'kill' the coccidia they limit its growth so that the buns own immune system can overcome the infection without it causing lasting damage, so it's definitely helpful in preventing spread and increasing immunity in the others. It's a ****** of an illness to diagnose, especially the hepatic version, because it can be pretty symptomless a lot of the time apart from weight loss.

I so hope I'm wrong, please let us know when you have spoken to your vet xx

loopylop
22-12-2008, 12:15 PM
Oh no :cry: Poor bambi, hugs to you hun xxx

BirdieBun
22-12-2008, 12:54 PM
Okay............the vet is treating her for Coccidiosis........however only because her results mean she has either a tumour on her liver or heptatic coccidiosis............she is only going to try and treat this as the next step is a liver biopsy and as this is so traumatic that is to be the last resort......the vet said if she is going to respond to the septrum it will be more or less instant for her weight gain then we will treat my other bunnies.........she said regarding sending off her faeces that it coudl still come back negative even though she may still have it so it is not worth it.

I do trust my vet....I have to take bambi back in 1 week's time fior another weigh in and we will see what what......her bloods show liver failure signs so this is why she is narrowing it down to these 2 things.

I said shouldn't I start treating my bunnies she said bambi would have had Heptatic coccs for a long time and so to treat the others when we aren't cofnirmed that Bambi has it would be a bi too cautious.

So I am going to go along with what they say and thank you all for your help I will keep you all updated xxxxxx

Sooz
22-12-2008, 01:00 PM
Has she ruled out EC too? That can also cause liver failure. :(

Becki xX
22-12-2008, 01:04 PM
I am devestated for you. This is like re-living Daniels illness all over again - Its horrendous :cry: X

antigone
22-12-2008, 01:19 PM
Sending lots of vibes.

Jack's-Jane
22-12-2008, 01:43 PM
Oh god Carys after the year you have had now this :cry:

Lets hope that Bambi gains some weight and that her immune system can get on top of things.

xx

AlisonA
22-12-2008, 01:45 PM
Awww hun :( Please please keep a really close eye on the others, even to the point of weighing them on your kitchen scales daily - time really is of the essence in treating cocci. In all honesty I really wouldn't be surprised if the two others you have lost recently are also linked to this, so I wouldn't necessarily agree with your vets assertion that she would have been carrying it for a while so it must be ok for the others.

If it is indeed cocci, it sounds as if it's got to the stage where the numbers of coccidia have started to get far greater (even if she was previously a carrier it sounds as if now she has an active infection) which I do think puts the others at higher risk, and particularly in conjunction with two other recent losses I would be concerned about this. Personally I think the risks associated with treating the others is significantly lower than the risk of them catching cocci.

At the very least, please do the cleaning and disinfecting etc as I suggested earlier, as at least this should minimise the spread of active spores.

I really, really hope it's not this, and I don't say any of the above lightly, but I have unfortunately had quite a bit of experience with cocci and know how serious it can get if it's not contained. Big hugs, and I do hope that Bambi starts to feel much better very soon xxx