Excessive drinking U/D outlook is bleak :(

Rocky seems to have developed a slight incontinence problem again - this will be the third time in about 4-5 months. The first two times the vet suspected a UTI and he had a course of antibiotics which cleared it up on both occasions. However, they said if it recurs then they would do some further investigation into what could possibly be a deeper problem.

Since friday night I've noticed little drops of pinkish urine (which he never does outside his littler tray unless there is a problem as he is very well litter trained) on the ground. I also checked his bottom and it's constantly damp - I tried cleaning with a baby wipe until I make a vet appt tomorrow.

I have also been measuring how much water he drinks - in the last 24 hours he's had 400-500mls which seems like a heck of a lot!! I've had to refill his bowl twice in one day!

He is due another course of panacur which I am now waiting to be delivered so I can start, and I have a urine test kit to collect his urine and give to the vet so they can do whatever it is they do!

Does anyone have any suggestions as to what his problem could be? I don't want to be fobbed off to just try another course of antibiotics as it's clearly not getting to the root of the problem. I'm worried that with his excessive drinking/urinating (medically known as polyuria/polydypsia, or PU/PD) it could point to a kidney problem?

Is there something specific i shoudl expect the vet to do now to further investigate, or something I should ask?

He seems in good spirits otherwise - I hope he's not just prone to UTIs! :?

Hiya, I've had similar probs recently with Gregory although he's not incontinent as such. Don't know what to say, only try not to worry yourself too much. Gregory has had X-rays to look for calcification of his organs (I think?), his blood sugar levels tested and we're currently awaiting results of blood and urine tests which will look at his kidney/liver function and EC. Hope it gets sorted soon - I know how worrying it is. Loads of vibes for your little one!

EC is a likely suspect (which means panacur paste) although another course of antibiotics alongside probably wouldn't hurt if there is blood in the urine. My EC bunny has recovered fine although he needs panacuring about 3-4 times a year.

ecudc said:

EC is a likely suspect (which means panacur paste) although another course of antibiotics alongside probably wouldn't hurt if there is blood in the urine. My EC bunny has recovered fine although he needs panacuring about 3-4 times a year.

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Have to agree with this. Sending vibes

Thanks for the replies guys. So I bought three tubes of panacur, how long do you think I should treat him for? longer than the 10 days? Maybe two tubes worth?

uniqueanneek said:

Thanks for the replies guys. So I bought three tubes of panacur, how long do you think I should treat him for? longer than the 10 days? Maybe two tubes worth?

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28 Days.... BUT I would also get your Vet to check him over again. Does he have a history of sludgey wee? He may have cystitis caused by sludge irritating the bladder in which case he will need antibiotics and pain relief.

Jack's-Jane said:

28 Days.... BUT I would also get your Vet to check him over again. Does he have a history of sludgey wee? He may have cystitis caused by sludge irritating the bladder in which case he will need antibiotics and pain relief.

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I will take him to the vet anyway, I've checked his bottom again tonight and it's now starting to get a bit matted from being damp, despite my attempts at cleaning it. It's also now slightly urine stained and smells. Poor wee thing. I have trimmed what he would let me.

He doesn't have a history of sludgey wee, I've never noticed it before and all the little puddles he's been leaving look normal, if slightly pinkish coloured. He doesn't appear to be in pain either, as he's acting himself and is running around, begging for food etc.

I also keep him on a very strict diet - he only gets one or two leaves a day on top of his hay/pellets, as some treats have been known to upset his digestion in the past. So i don't think his problem is diet related.

I will try and get a good urine sample to take to the vets with me for tomorrow too.

Ok well tonight he seems to have got worse - he's not doing so many puddles around the place as such, but his rear end got soaking wet tonight :? It was really quite smelly and urine coloured, so I've bathed him, which he didn't take too kindly too.

I basically just picked him up and sat his rear end in a bowl of lukewarm water, and sponged him down as long as he would let me. Then I dried him with the hair dryer on cool whilst he nibbled a carrot.

I didn't have any animal shampoo and I didn't want to use my shampoo because I didn't know if it would be mild or gentle enough. So i added a tiny bit of tesco antiseptic stuff (like dettol) to the water - VERY dilute, like literally just a couple of mls (it said it can be used for bathing babies) so I thought it would be ok for rocky.

I noticed his bum (or where his plums used to be - not too sure what's what down there ) was a little hard feeling, and very urine stained :? I feel so bad for the wee fella. Luckily I'm doing an all nighter trying to finish my thesis anyway so I can keep an eye on him.

I'm booking him in for the vets first thing to try and get whatever is causing this treated.

Poor lad, sounds as though he has some Urine Scald now too

Good luck at the Vets today

Good luck at the vet this morning.

fingers crossed for the vets

well we're back from the vets. Rocky is a little bit more subdued today but not enough to make me panic, he's still running around when he thinks there might be food on the go!

They tested his urine and said that it was as dilute as urine pretty much can be, and at the rate he's drinking it suggests that he could have something which is preventing his kidneys from reabsorbing water back into the cirulation - whether that be physical or a chemical (related to the anti-diuretic hormone).
She said he is urinated so much because his body might not be absorbing the water like its supposed to, and so he's urinating loads and therefore still thirsty and drinking lots.

She didn't give me any meds because she's booked him in for the day on wednesday and they're going to scan his bladder and kidneys, and do blood cultures and kidney function tests, and she doesn't want meds affecting the diagnosis.

She thinks that because he is still in good spirits and moving around normally and eating then he'll be ok withou meds until then.

Poor wee man, he's goin to get shaved! I'm just glad to finally be trying to get to the root cause of the problem.

She says I will have to keep an eye on his bum and bathe him again if necessary.

I hope you got on ok at the vets! I am having a similar problem with my rabbit. He seems fine but has exactly the same symptoms as your rabbit. I'm booking the vets tomorrow, but let us know how you get on with him.

clairevidler said:

I hope you got on ok at the vets! I am having a similar problem with my rabbit. He seems fine but has exactly the same symptoms as your rabbit. I'm booking the vets tomorrow, but let us know how you get on with him.

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Awh, it can be quite worrying eh? I hope you manage to get to the bottom of it today?

Rocky's in at the vet today getting his scan and and xray now so hopefully I'll be a bit more clued up about his problem when I go to collect him!

*crosses fingers*

So I've just returned home with the Rocky from the vet. After scans, xrays and blood tests they've decided that Rocky has cysts in his kidneys (which he could have had since birth - it's not clear why). These keep getting infected and filling with puss, causing damage to his kidney tissue each time.

Each kidney needs 2/3rds of its cell number to function properly (which don't regenerate after damage), and with the levels of creatin(i think that's what it's called) being elevated as much as they were, suggests an already significant level of damage.

At the moment he's averaging an infection every 6 weeks, and the vet said that he'll keep getting them until his kidney mass deterioration reaches it's limit and he ends up having kidney failure. This could happen very quickly, as soon as just one or two more bouts of infection, depending on the level of damage already done.

He'll just have to have a course of antibiotics each time he gets one, until the damage proves too much. There is apparently nothing else they can do.

I've been in tears for the last hour

He doesn't appear to be in pain when he gets the infections - he'll probably just be in pain when it eventually all gets too much for him. He's only 10 months old and just the most loving, fun, playful rabbit you could imagine. It's just the two of us now and we have just the best relationship I really wasn't expecting this news

Oh no, I am so sorry to hear that news. You must be devastated. Poor little bunny. Heartbreaking.

Sorry to hear about him and hope they can do something to help.

Might be worth asking your vet about fortekor- this is used in cats with kidney failure and can help to prolong their life. It won't be licenced for rabbits, but they can phone up and ask whether they think it might be effective. I have ended up using lots of unlicenced produces on my animals, partly because I think its worth trying something rather than nothing and for the likes of goats there is very little licenced for them, so you just got to try something.

I'm sorry to hear about poor Rocky.

I agree that it may be worth investigating other treatments. Would the Rabbit Welfare Association be able to suggest a specialist? It's got to be worth a phone call.

Lots of vibes

FC xx

Poor Rocky.

So sorry this was not the best results but you now know what you are dealing with and can do some research in case there are any other options.

I hope that this can be controlled for some time yet. Sending some nose rubs to him and a hug to you.

Sorry you've had such bad news.

doesn't EC cause cysts? I'd say it is very much worth trying the panacur again but also investigate the other options suggested.