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given up:edit calling janice for advice

bunlover

Warren Veteran
right well now iv given up there is no harm in telling you aftersootyspeyed she nchelsea decided to have a massive lock on fight mum speerated them but they constantly went for each other dad seperated the garden and the rabbit room and the run so they are fine and safe and this week they have been back to me for re bonding.

well mon-yesterday went really really well with them lying together and snuggling and licking and grooming each other. today they had a lock on fight i seperated them immediatly there was absolutly no reason for it they just went mental at each other... dont understand it. sooty is fine no injurys but chelsea has a nasty cut and the lump of fur (a large one) that sooty pulled out had skin attatched to it.... i tried them again later today but they went for each other i eventually sperated them as no good can come of it i may need to take chelsea to vet tommorrow im really upset about it

how can they go from being so loving to hating each other...everything was neutral and everything had gone fine until then and its been a month so sootys hormones had settled so its not that and chelsea was speyed years ago....both are 9 and 10 yrs old will now live seperatly does anyone know what i did wrong for them to suddenly change... as feel so bad. as i genuinly thought i could re bond them. they go home to mum on sat and will continue to live side by side in seperated areas now.
 
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dominancy can do it they might be establishing that mine do

or maby they have just taken a dislike to each other the guinea pigs did that just put them in seperate cages near each other so they cna smell each other ithout ebing able to attack one another or you may just have to seperate them completly im affraid :(
 
I know this sounds like a stupid question but did you thoroughly check the bunny who had some fur pulled with skin attached? One of my bunnies did this to the other and the wound wasn't apparent until I turned her over and saw the damage. Or do you just mean a top layer of skin was removed? :?
 
Hi - bunlover's Mum here. I live in Gloucester and my daughter in London. They were sent to her for a week's bonding holiday because Sooty had become aggressive after the spey, and they had had a locked on fight* here in Gloucester.*
- Such a shame, as we spent a couple of years trying to find a partner for Chelsea of similar age(she's 10 and Sooty 9)and were so pleased when we got Sooty from a rescue recently.Because of location and neutral territory Sooty went to her house first and so I took Chelsea up to London for a week to bond them in April this year. Once she had bonded them they came back to me.*

They soon settled in Gloucester and became loving bunny buddies. After much debate and realising the risk of uterine cancer was no less, and having a good rabbit-savvy vet we went ahead with Sooty's spey. As Chelsea totally hates the vets and being indoors I let Sooty go to vets for spey alone. (With hindsight this was probably wrong, but there we are). I have been unable to rebond them or put them overnight together since the spey last month.
My husband had to divide everything in half with 3ft mesh fences- the rabbit room, the run, and the small garden. The rabbit room to rabbit run had to have a new set of ramps and new little rabbit door alteration to the main back door too. (We have not divided up the main garden as they have to go in turn through gates from the small garden).
They cannot get to one another and will now have to live permanently like this I suppose.I was just hoping they might have rebonded...can't understand why they spent a couple of days licking one another then had a huge fight????? What's going on?* They come back with me this Saturday evening. -Sue:(
 
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HI :wave:

Oh dear...

It's difficult enough to bond two does as you already know, and when Sooty came back from the vet she would have smelled more or less like a stranger to Chelsea. I'm not sure if you will be able to get them back together..I never push rabbits who lock on fight and if I were in your position I would be wary to keep trying given their age. It must put them under a lot of stress each time they have a fight. It may be worth just keeping them side by side for a while and letting them settle down. So long as your divides have very fine mesh on they won't be able to nip each other and I would be inclined to see how they interact with each other this way.
 
Is it not worth getting both checked to see if there is actually something wrong with one of them. I had two sisters who were really close and then for no apparent reason one started attacking the other and it was horrible. I phoned my vet who said to take them both in and she would check them over, it turned out one was ill she had a tumour behind the eye. I am not saying this is the case with one of these two but it may just be worth getting them checked.
Good luck and I really hope all works out and you haven't done anything so don't go blaming yourself;)
 
That's an interesting thought Kay.
Of course Sooty had a full check-up by our rabbit savvy vet prior to spey but things could develop in a month. Sooty does have eyesight problems (lens sclerosis) which means she can't see very well close-up (but the fight took place in a large garden where they both bombed at each other from opposite ends so it was nothing to do with that). I gather they were hopping round then suddenly both spotted one another and both went for each other.

However- after the lock-on fight they had in Gloucester before going for the bonding holiday in London I THOUGHT there were only minor injuries so didn't get either checked by a vet. However if one of them did have an injury making them grumpy-why were they cuddled up and licking one another again indoors the day before?
Chelsea may have to go to my daughters vet today anyway to check injury from the last fight, so I will mention to her and see if she wants to take Sooty for a check too.-Sue
 
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Were there any other rabbits nearby that could have caused them to fight? Some rabbits seem to get upset easily when there are others around.
 
Yes and no

Bunlovers two rabbits were there, in another part of the garden but with hutch covers so that they couldn't see them and they would not distract Sooty and Chelsea, (though I appreciate you can't stop smells going through the air). It had been raining heavily so no rabbit smells on grass.

Any advice on what to do when they come home Sat night(it will be too late to put them in the garden. The rabbit room (indoor)has easily removable(unscrewable) mesh panels. The panels in the adjoining rabbit run would need some time to remove as the roof would have to be taken off first and not a job I can ask hubby to do in the dark after a 6hr round trip drive. The small garden is divided by 2 x 5ft gates which can easily(double bolts) be opened.

When I heard they were snuggling up and licking one another again I was planning to white vinegar everything and remove panels but clearly I now cannot.
Any advice on how I can re-bond them once back here please?-Sue
 
ok well is she online? janice we need some help?!! could do with advice. in reply to the question regarding taking to the vets, both buns have had thourough check up by myself for injurys(though i realise if there were underlying problems this would need ot be found by a vet) the only problem i have found is where the top layer of skin had been removed on chelsea in the fight.i have decided to let it heal on its own as chelsea has had several allergic reactions before to creams and stuff. (it really was a fight im not making a fuss over fur pulling or chasing so i hope that no one feels this is the case,) i wonder even if they did get rebonded somewhere that they may then become unbonded once home as seem tot fight over territory more than anything?

i cannot try the car journey trick as chelsea is the one showing more signs of aggression and has travelled well though gets grumpy all her life she doesnt mind cars and would almost certainatly turn on sooty under these conditions. unfortunatly i am at a loss i dont think i want to try them together again even indoors as i did try yesterday after the fight and i had to seperate them again. sadly maybe it is not meant to be :(

regarding my buns being a problem it is possible but they bonded fine with them around the last time and they do know each other due to visits to mums and them to me when either of us has gone away.

not sure what the next step is they go home tommorrow.(to mum sdf76)
 
also for those who do not know the history chelsea has gone for every white rabbit and every male rabbit she has met and only seems to like females.it is so daft but we ony had the option of a girlie freind for her as that is al lshe will accept.
 
:wave::wave:

Sorry just a little engrossed with trying to get my animals cleaned out and keep an eye on the 2 lots I started off at 1.30 bonding and getting pictures uploaded for my other thread.

Can I clarify what I think has happened as I tend not to have time to ready all the threads people post.

This is 2 females previously who lived together, one recently spayed with its partner remaining at home whilst the other one was at the vets. With problems rebonding afterwards, they now are on neutral territory at your daughters who has other rabbits.

Questions:
1. Do you have other rabbits where you live?
2. Were they immediatly put back together when the spayed rabbit returned from the vet?
3. which one started the fighting ... although difficult to tell at times,
4. Was this initial pairing up following spey on neutral territory?
5. Was the second pairing up on territory where other rabbits had been previously without being thoroughly cleaned?
6. How many weeks post spey is the girl?
7. Is the other girl speyed? How long ago?

Without even considering any of the above my concerns are 2 females can at times be difficult to pair up ... but not always.

General other bits:
Sometimes neutering will increase the hormones in the blood prior to them settling down.
Depending on how old they are may mean that they were less hormonal when they were previously paired up. This can make older buns who are recently neutered more difficult to pair up.

Not having seen them fight it is difficult to say whether to try again and where to go and without having any of the above answers I would be reluctant to suggest giving up ... It is a pity that they are going home this weekend and also that you are not nearer, I would have them over here when I have some free slots in my pairing up and assess them for you.

Other thoughts are to get small videos of how they are so that I can see, also supply lots of info about situation they are in ... maybe able to make some suggestions from there.
 
A thought ... do they have to go back this weekend?

If they don't ..... do you want me to have them the following weekend and give it a go?
 
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