What's next for Frankie? Another update!

My little boy bun, Frankie, still isn't eating all of his soft poos despite both he and his partner Jen being on a hay only diet for just under three weeks now

I took both rabbits to the vet just over a week ago but he couldn't find anything obviously wrong with either Frankie's teeth or his general mobility, or anything to suggest why Frankie won't eat his caecotrophs. He gave Frankie some Metacam to see if that made any difference, but it didn't. Both buns had a short course of Panacur too.

I have actually seen Frankie poo and hop off away without eating it now, so it is definitely him (although I've also noticed that Jen occasionally hoovers them up :mrgreen: , so maybe he's actually leaving even more poos than I realised )

The vet suggested giving it a week and then bringing Frankie back in for further tests. What sort of things do you think they will do, or is there anything in particular I should ask to be done for my little guy? What about X-rays?

Thanks!

Morrigan1981 said:

My little boy bun, Frankie, still isn't eating all of his soft poos despite both he and his partner Jen being on a hay only diet for just under three weeks now

I took both rabbits to the vet just over a week ago but he couldn't find anything obviously wrong with either Frankie's teeth or his general mobility, or anything to suggest why Frankie won't eat his caecotrophs. He gave Frankie some Metacam to see if that made any difference, but it didn't. Both buns had a short course of Panacur too.

I have actually seen Frankie poo and hop off away without eating it now, so it is definitely him (although I've also noticed that Jen occasionally hoovers them up :mrgreen: , so maybe he's actually leaving even more poos than I realised )

The vet suggested giving it a week and then bringing Frankie back in for further tests. What sort of things do you think they will do, or is there anything in particular I should ask to be done for my little guy? What about X-rays?

Thanks!

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Are his caecotrophs well formed ?

Janex

Jack's-Jane said:

Are his caecotrophs well formed ?

Janex

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Hi Jane Yes they are, they look just like little bunches of grapes. Is that a good sign?

Morrigan1981 said:

Hi Jane Yes they are, they look just like little bunches of grapes. Is that a good sign?

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Thats perfect !!

TBH if he is perfectly well in himself, is maintaining his weight and any potential tooth problems have been ruled out I would just 'wait and see'.
A whole remit of 'tests' are unlikely to give you many answers and will just mean added stress for Frankie. If your Vet is certain he does not have molar spurs and Frankie is 'well' in all other ways I really would hold fire for a while.

It doesn't sound as though he is getting a mucky bum, just leaving perfectly formed 'bunches of grapes' yes ?

Appart from hay what other foods does he have ?

Janex

Thanks Jane. I did wonder if putting Frankie through a load of tests would just be too stressful for him, but at the same time the change in his behaviour has concerned me.

No, he doesn't have a mucky bum, he literally just leaves his poos where they are. I just remove from the hutch them morning and night, sometimes it's just one and at worst I'll find three.

At the moment both rabbits are still just on hay. When I first noticed he wasn't eating his poos I had hoped that a few days on hay alone would clear it up. It did help a bit, but not entirely. When I saw the vet last week he suggested keeping them on hay alone for a while longer, but obviously it's not a long term solution!

Before this problem started they used to also have a small amount of SS in the morning (one handful between two) and a bit of veg every other day. They used to have veg every day, but then Frankie had bloat twice and so the vet suggested cutting back.

So his teeth have been checked?

What do you mean with regard to his 'change in behaviour' apart from leaving the caecotrphs ?

Does he eat grass?

What sort of hay ?

Have you tried him with some Fibreplex?

Soz for all the questions!! :lol:

Janex

:lol: It's OK, I really appreciate the help! Frankie is my special little pudding and I really just want him to be well

Jack's-Jane said:

So his teeth have been checked?

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Yes, the vet checked them with an octoscope but he couldn't see anything untoward.

Jack's-Jane said:

What do you mean with regard to his 'change in behaviour' apart from leaving the caecotrphs ?

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Oops, sorry, I just meant the fact that he's suddenly stopped eating his caecotrophs. Previously I very rarely found any in their hutch.

Actually, there is one other thing but I'm not sure if it's related :? He's been a bit grumpy with Jen recently whilst they are being fed.. if I open the hutch to change their litter tray, he'll start lunging at Jen and then huddling up into the corner. Once I shut the door again though, he's absolutely fine and he'll share the food with her, flop out and groom her with no problems at all. He's always been a very skittish nervous boy, but I've only recently noticed him being grumpy with Jen like that. They adore each other the rest of the time.

Jack's-Jane said:

Does he eat grass?

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No.. unfortunately our garden is all paved, so we don't have any I pick dandelions for them every few days and they both love those. I could get some grass from the local park, but I'm not sure how clean it'd be :? (possibly not very.. there's a main road alongside)

Jack's-Jane said:

What sort of hay ?

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They have the Dust Free meadow hay - I buy the 'stalky' type Both buns eat a lot of hay and are always dive into a pile of fresh hay with great enthuasium!

Jack's-Jane said:

Have you tried him with some Fibreplex?

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No, I haven't... Is it something that my vets will have? If so, I'll call in on Monday and get some

Thanks again Jane :wave:

Morrigan1981 said:

:lol: It's OK, I really appreciate the help! Frankie is my special little pudding and I really just want him to be well



Yes, the vet checked them with an octoscope but he couldn't see anything untoward.



Oops, sorry, I just meant the fact that he's suddenly stopped eating his caecotrophs. Previously I very rarely found any in their hutch.

Actually, there is one other thing but I'm not sure if it's related :? He's been a bit grumpy with Jen recently whilst they are being fed.. if I open the hutch to change their litter tray, he'll start lunging at Jen and then huddling up into the corner. Once I shut the door again though, he's absolutely fine and he'll share the food with her, flop out and groom her with no problems at all. He's always been a very skittish nervous boy, but I've only recently noticed him being grumpy with Jen like that. They adore each other the rest of the time.



No.. unfortunately our garden is all paved, so we don't have any I pick dandelions for them every few days and they both love those. I could get some grass from the local park, but I'm not sure how clean it'd be :? (possibly not very.. there's a main road alongside)



They have the Dust Free meadow hay - I buy the 'stalky' type Both buns eat a lot of hay and are always dive into a pile of fresh hay with great enthuasium!



No, I haven't... Is it something that my vets will have? If so, I'll call in on Monday and get some

Thanks again Jane :wave:

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Righto, well I am still thinking along the molar spur lines.
The reason I say this is that it's impossible to view a Buns mouth thoroughly whilst they are awake, even with an otoscope.
Some Buns will carry on eating and behaving normally despite having flippin' great spurs digging into their cheeks/tongue. Other Buns can have the tiniest of spur or slightly too long/sharp molars and they have either subtle symptoms ( not eating caecotrophs, grumpiness, drinking more - water, they dont keep nipping down the pub !! :lol:- licking various surfaces, excessive grooming, small hard poos......etc.....etc ) or they stop eating immediately and go into stasis.

If you were going down any route re 'tests' a thorough Dental examination under GA is where I'd start.

You can obtain Fibreplex from Vets. You can also buy it online

http://www.petvetcare.co.uk/acatalog/Small_Animals_Pets.html

Janex

HI, sorry to hear Frankie is not too well. Not being any sort of expert at all I think the same as Jane (always a good idea :lol if he's being grumpy with Jen he might be hurting somewhere. Hope he perks up soon x

This might sound strange but is just a suggestion.

One of my bunnies just didn't like them so I added probiotics to his water and he started to eat them again. The vet thought they might have changed the taste of them. Don't know if this is true but is woth a try

Hugo's There said:

This might sound strange but is just a suggestion.

One of my bunnies just didn't like them so I added probiotics to his water and he started to eat them again. The vet thought they might have changed the taste of them. Don't know if this is true but is woth a try

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Not strange at all Thats why I suggested the Fibreplex :thumb:

Discussing the flavour of poo................Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeewwwwwww :mrgreen:

:lol:

Janex

Jack's-Jane said:

Not strange at all Thats why I suggested the Fibreplex :thumb:

Discussing the flavour of poo................Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeewwwwwww :mrgreen:

:lol:

Janex

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:lol::lol::lol: well we have colour and size quite frequently. Never considered they wouldn't like the taste of them! Weird. (not the suggestion )

:lol: The 'changing tastes of poo' conversation is very funny! :lol: Thanks for the suggestions everyone, I'll speak to my vet tomorrow first thing about getting hold of some Fibreplex and also to arrange an appointment asap to take Frankie in again.

Jane, I think your theory about a molar spur might be correct - I gave both buns some raspberry leaves yesterday and noticed that whilst Jen gobbled hers down immediately, Frankie was chewing very slowly and even dropped his leaf at one point Hopefully the vet will be able to see him tomorrow morning before I go to work and we can talk about an investigative GA for his teeth, and possibly a dental

We're not 100% sure of Frankie's age, but think that he's about 3-4yrs. Will he be OK having an anaesthetic at his age?

Morrigan1981 said:

:lol: The 'changing tastes of poo' conversation is very funny! :lol: Thanks for the suggestions everyone, I'll speak to my vet tomorrow first thing about getting hold of some Fibreplex and also to arrange an appointment asap to take Frankie in again.

Jane, I think your theory about a molar spur might be correct - I gave both buns some raspberry leaves yesterday and noticed that whilst Jen gobbled hers down immediately, Frankie was chewing very slowly and even dropped his leaf at one point Hopefully the vet will be able to see him tomorrow morning before I go to work and we can talk about an investigative GA for his teeth, and possibly a dental

We're not 100% sure of Frankie's age, but think that he's about 3-4yrs. Will he be OK having an anaesthetic at his age?

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I have had 9-10 year old Buns go under GA
Obviously there is always a risk with any GA, regardless of the Buns age. But your Vet will give Frankie a thorough examination ( listen to his heart/lungs and check his abdomen ) before going ahead.
I have an 8+ year old Bun (Chloe) who is probably going to have to have a Dental tomorrow too.

Janex

Aaaaaw poor Frankie - I hope the vet gets to the bottom of this for you Tracey (no pun intended), give him a cuddle from his Aunty Lynne

Thanks Jane and Lynne. When I checked this morning there were no uneaten poos at all and I even saw Frankie cleaning his bottom ( ), so it's all very confusing!

I've spoken to the vets already and the earliest that Tim can see Frankie again is Friday :? I would have much rather that someone could see him today, although, I do also have some Fibreplex now so in some way maybe waiting til Friday to see if that helps before dragging Frankie to the vets again might not be a bad thing :? I'm not sure I think it's the common quandary facing rabbit owners - get your bun to the vet immediately to see anyone, or wait to see the one vet you know actually knows a thing or two about rabbits?! :?

Anyway, I've made the appointment but if I'm in anyway unsure about Frankie then I'll just take him in immediately as an emergency.

I hope Chloe's dental goes well Jane - sending lots of vibes for her x

Update - I tried the Fibreplex and so far it seems to have worked! We've had two full days now without any uneaten soft poops, so I'm feeling quite optimistic. If we get through tomorrow as well then I think I'll cancel the appointment for Friday.

Frankie has been pretty good about taking the fibreplex too, although it must taste nice because I've also had to give a tiny bit to a stampy Jen each time too, she hates missing out :roll:

Yay! I'm so, so pleased. Thanks Jane and Liz for your suggestions :thumb:

Morrigan1981 said:

Update - I tried the Fibreplex and so far it seems to have worked! We've had two full days now without any uneaten soft poops, so I'm feeling quite optimistic. If we get through tomorrow as well then I think I'll cancel the appointment for Friday.

Frankie has been pretty good about taking the fibreplex too, although it must taste nice because I've also had to give a tiny bit to a stampy Jen each time too, she hates missing out :roll:

Yay! I'm so, so pleased. Thanks Jane and Liz for your suggestions :thumb:

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Great news !!
Frankie says Fibreplex makes his poo taste



:lol:

Janex

Jack's-Jane said:

Great news !!
Frankie says Fibreplex makes his poo taste



:lol:

Janex

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It's obviously the secret carrot flavouring that makes rabbits go MMmmm! :lol:

It was so funny when I told my husband that one of the reasons that Frankie might not be eating his poo was because Frankie had decided that it didn't taste very nice. Poor hubby just looked confused and said, 'umm, yes, that would be because it's poo' :lol:

Awww hope Frankie continues to eat his poo :shock: - well you know what I mean!!!

Hugs to him and Jen