Dentals..quick opinions

[honeybunny]

We have had debates on here before re conscious dentals..and there has been a lot of anti feeling towards them due to vets advice ..

but we use 2 different vets who do them without ga..
.. we have had 2 seperate occassions where the vet had just caught the rabbits cheek..admitted this, painkiller given and bun was fine, eating within 2 hours...and that is 2 out of hundreds if visits......(and this happens with ga too)

Most rabbits are eating in their carriers on the journey back from vet!

Lately I have heard of 4 rabbits..(and this is in the last 3-4 months)..who have had dentals with a ga..and have been really poorly afterwards....2 have died:cry:.....

so can people post a quick answer as to

A) has your rabbit had a dental with ga and was fine

B) has your bunny had a dental WITHOUT ga and was fine

C) has your rabbbit had a dental with ga and was ill/or took a long time to recover

D) as bun has dental without ga and was ill/took long time to recover

[davies67]

my bun had to have her teeth done every 2-4 weeks and she got really stressed out every time so couldnt not have the ga. Afterwards she would barely eat her fave treats never mind hay.In the end i decieded with the vet it was just too much for her and that the constant drugs and stress was a poor quality of life for her so she had to be pts.very sad but for her the whole thing was just awful, and for me to watch her so upset a lot was really sad. so i really think it depends on the buns character, iff she was way way more laid back she still may be here, who knows:(

[abbymarysmokey]

A) Yes

B) Yes

C) Yes...my elderly rabbit Sh*tty wouldn't eat after a GA dental and had to be syringe fed.

D) No...all mine have been fine within minutes.

I think sometimes rabbits take longer to recover from GA dentals because more severe dental problems have to be done under GA.

Amy

[charlie82]

I would never allow my rabbit to have a dental without GA. I wouldn't expect to have such treatment myself without local anesthetic, so I certainly wouldn't do that to my rabbits!

I don't take eating as a sign that they are completely pain free. I've had a rabbit with a fractured jaw who carried on eating as normal...it's what they are designed to do. I wouldn't presume that they were pain free. I think my rabbits would be more traumatised by the ordeal if they were awake during the procedure.

[Bavarian Bunny]

My Popsel had bad teeth a while ago and he needed dentals almost every month. They did not want to give him a GA because he was already 10. He's 12 now and his teeth are back to normal. He never had any problems after the dentals. He was very stressed as soon as my mother put him in the carrier and he knew what was going to happen. But during the dentals they probably only clipped off sharp bits from the molars and did not file them back to the gums like some vets do. I don't think that could be done without GA.

[Rallybunny]

Evo takes a while to recover from the GA after a dental, but I think that's partly to do with him reacting to the painkiller, as when he was given Vetergesic for something else on Sunday, he was really out of it all day, as soon as the painkiller kicked in.

[Hunnybunny2007]

Twinkle has had 2 dentals without ga and has been fine.
Allso Martha had to have one - Martha is a sickly rabbit at the best of times so I wouldn't allow her to have GA - this is the reason she has not been speyed.
Both were eating on the way home, and didn't seem to be stressed at all.

Sue x

[Sooz]

1. Yes, several and a couple more than once.
2. Yes, but only work on the incisors and was later admited for GA molar work
3. No. Even my incisor removal rabbit was eating within an hour of arriving home.
4. No but neither vet surgery will perform conscious molar work

I will add that my vets no longer use a burr on molar work due to the risk of soft tissue damage.

[abbymarysmokey]

4. No but neither vet surgery will perform conscious molar work


I thought your vet was planning to teach you to do dentals at home? Wouldn't this presumably be conscious?

[Sooz]

Anita said she could in theory teach me to crumble away large spurs on a placid bunny for between GA dentals. In practice, Im not comfortable with it and would rather them have infrequent GAs than keep p**s arseing about with stressed rabbits.

I would also need to buy a few pieces of not cheap veterinary kit :?

They will not do this on clients rabbits, I am guessing for the reasons above.

[rngpwelfare]

Are we talking about front teeth or back teeth here ?

[bunnymadhouse]

Thumper has a dental (back teeth ) every 3 months or so .
with all his other probs and his age ...9.5 yrs i keep expecting problems ....but so far in 7 yrs there has only been 1 occasion when he had us worried ...he was slow to come around from the anesthetic....then next time he was fine again .

i would nt have a dental done on him without GA as he would be terrified .

front teeth are different ....yes we have front teeth burred without GA .

[Happy Hopping]

Goofball first surgery was w/o GA, it's for cutting of 4 molars--horriable surgery to say the least. She was really frighten afterwards, shaking for 1 day full.

The other day Bernie has 2 molars. I insist that the vet put him under GA to do it properly. That way, they also have time to sand down any sharp teeth.

[Jaypot]

We always insist on the Isoflurane gas for any dentals as it's quicker for them to recover - and remembering that most of our buns are already compromised health wise.
The ones that we had done with the injectable took so long to recover - but with the gas they are up and eating right away:D
I actually think it's barbaric to do dentals while they are conscious - but thats just my opinion:D

[AlisonA]

I also think that it's not simply a case of whether they are fine or not straight after the GA - there is also the quality of the dental to take into consideration. Doing it conscious might nip off a sharp point but it won't resolve any bigger issues. So I don't think you can take each incident as isolated - you have to look at the bigger picture of whether the actual dental is helping to slow tooth root overgrowth, and/or whether a few frequent 'decent' dentals under GA might mean that the bun needs less dentals in the long run - or not as the case may be, I don't know!

Santa certainly has dental issues and even with her snuffles, there is no way I would allow her to have a conscious dental, they couldn't manage a conscious x-ray she's such a wiggler!

[Sooz]

We always insist on the Isoflurane gas for any dentals as it's quicker for them to recover - and remembering that most of our buns are already compromised health wise.


My vets also use isoflurane for dentals but prefere to mask rather than intubate so there is more room to work in the mouth.

[clutterydrawer]

Sorrel had a GA for her dental - *I* was weeing myself, but she was fine. :rolleyes: she was feasting away straight after she came to. she is a resilient little beastie though.

I would prefer if she didnt have to have the GA but she won't even let someone touch her chin without running and hiding so there's no way she'd let them do a dental.

[BinkyBun]

Okay i voted GA but was ill/took a while to recover. I have only ever had one experience of this with Darcy. Luckily change of hay (he was bored of the old stuff) and he hasn't needed another dental (touch wood).

Darcy didn't get ill afterwards as in need antbx or anything like that. But he was in a terrible state, acting drunk until the next day. He didn't eat till the next day either which terrified me. I've never been so happy to a bunny drinking water!!

If I had the choice, and Darcy (or any of my buns) did need regular monthly dentals, then I would seriously consider the conscious dentals as long as they really were pain-free. Again would have to check with vet to see what they thought/preferred doing. Check their mortality rates etc.

Its a topic worth looking into.

[Pringle]

Pringle gets his done under GA,to be honest i dont think he would sit for the vet to do them without it, the sample packs of excel you get at the vet they gave pringle one of them one day to get him to eat after, vet nurse went away for a short time and she said she nearly collapsed when she came back and pringle had eaten the whole lot :lol::lol::lol::lol:

[Jack's-Jane]

I would not want any of my Buns to have a Dental without some form of sedation. My personal opinion and that of my trusted Vet is that it is too stressful and too risky to do so. If an accidental bleed occurs during a Dental it is possible to arrest the haemorrhage but only if the bleeding point can be identified. Impossible in a conscious Rabbit. My Vet also believes that Dentals without GA cannot be thorough as she says it is not possible to assess and treat each individual tooth. She also says that potential damage could be done if there is not a good occlusal surface after treatment.
My Vet would only use just Isofluorane for a severely debilitated Rabbit. This is because the gas has to be administered via a mask and the mask has to be removed to access the teeth and the Bun will keep waking up. Not ideal when trying to do a Dental but may be necessary if a full GA is out of the question.
As yet I have never had a problem with a Bun's recovery from a full GA and Dental

Janex

[Sooz]

I should have mentioned the mask used by Anita has been adapted to go over the nose only, therefor not infringing upon the access to the mouth. :)

[Jack's-Jane]

I should have mentioned the mask used by Anita has been adapted to go over the nose only, therefor not infringing upon the access to the mouth. :)

Crikes it must be teeny-weeny :shock:

Janex

[Thumpinbun]

I have only ever had 2 bunnies that have had a GA for dental work, Inca took nearly a week to recover and eat properly which seemed to almost defeat the object of having his teeth seen to anyway! My second bunny Domino died whilst under GA. Both of the above were carried out at different veterinary practices. These experiences have convinced me of two things -find a better vet, which I have done, and none of my rabbits will be given a GA for dental work.

All of my bunnies now see an excellent rabbit vet who does all their dental work without GA or sedation - none of them have suffered any ill effects from this.

[Sooz]

Crikes it must be teeny-weeny :shock:

Janex

I've not seen it personally but she went into quite some detail when I was asking her opinions on Burring and conscious dentals and she mentioned using an adapted mask to give more room to work in the mouth. :)

[Jimmy's mum]

hi.. the vet i worked with (hannah) used to intubate through the nose (paediatric size tube), then atached the iso the the tube.... the nurse (usually me) then held this in place along with the gag (to open mouth wide) fiddily but there was an art to doing this... lol.... she then had full access to the mouth whilst bun was safe and under full GA..

she used hypnorm (brill) to sedate and iso to maintain GA....

hypnorm had A* recovery rate.... far far far better than dom/torb...

:D

xx

[Hunnybunny2007]

Hope you don't mind this question, but when I got Twinkle she was approx 18 months old - I don't know a lot of her history but I wouldn't think she was taken to the vet very often- since new years day she has had 2 dentals, is this because her teeth are growing quicker because she is on a better diet. When she came she was on Sainsburys mix and very selective, and wasn't fussed about veg (I had to go through different types before we found her likes and dislikes) She eats loads of hay daily with veg at night and a small amount of A & P fed in 2 portions, morning and evening.

Sue x

[Glingle]

They had a bit on tonight's Animal Rescue (I think it's called) on Five at 6.30ish where they showed a vet trimming a bunny's overgrown front tooth with a drill thing. They said the rabbit was allergic to the GA drugs and said that rabbits natural diet wears their teeth down, unlike the pellet food pet rabbits eat. I thought that they could have said that giving rabbits lots of hay would help. :? Have to admit that although they had the bunny in a "trance" position and at one point had it wrapped in a towel as well, it didn't make me feel comfortable about it. I suppose it's better than having horrendous teeth that stop you from eating though. I guess it comes down to the skill of the vet and the needs and other health/stress issues a rabbit has as to whether it should be done.

[Jimmy's mum]

They had a bit on tonight's Animal Rescue (I think it's called) on Five at 6.30ish where they showed a vet trimming a bunny's overgrown front tooth with a drill thing. They said the rabbit was allergic to the GA drugs and said that rabbits natural diet wears their teeth down, unlike the pellet food pet rabbits eat. I thought that they could have said that giving rabbits lots of hay would help. :? Have to admit that although they had the bunny in a "trance" position and at one point had it wrapped in a towel as well, it didn't make me feel comfortable about it. I suppose it's better than having horrendous teeth that stop you from eating though. I guess it comes down to the skill of the vet and the needs and other health/stress issues a rabbit has as to whether it should be done.

i didnt see this proggrame, but it seems the vet in question mabe was not a bunny aware vet (they are out there) as long as you use a vet who knows about bunnies there is rarely a problem... all dentals can look off-putting but its always in the animals best interest. the drill can also look off-putting but they dont feel a thing (as long as they are under GA)...

x

[abbymarysmokey]

Can I just add that the vet in Nottingham who does the conscious dentals only does them for very minor dental work. Some rabbits stop eating because of the smallest of molar spurs (whilst others keep eating with horrendous malocclusion...go figure :? ).

For any dental work which takes more than a minute or so, or for nervous rabbits, they give them just enough iso. gas to keep them under for the duration of the dental.

Amy