Stasis AGAIN - Really need some advice please!

Hi All,

I posted just over a week ago about Betty going into stasis for seemingly no reason at all. She got over it and ate well for a week, then it happened again on Tuesday. She had the usual Metaclop', Metacam and an antibiotic injection and they booked her in to have a look at her teeth yesterday. Betty ate her veg overnight and had a tiny bit for breakfast so I thought she was on the mend. After a day in the vets (Benny went with her for company and they had a packed lunch) I brought her home. Her teeth were ok, a few spurs but they trimmed them off, nothing to cause pain and stop her eating though.

Since last night, she hasn't eaten anything of her own accord. I think she was still a bit groggy last night because she was a bit more fiesty this morning which is more normal for her. Anyway, I've been liquid feeding her with Recovery feed which she is taking ok but she just isn't eating herself. We're back at the vets tonight, so please send vibes to her today. I'm at work and worrying, which isn't helping.

I really need to know whats causing this as I really don't want to liquid feed indefinately and not to get to the bottom of this. My other bunny, Alice had recurrent stasis but it was due to her not eating hay because she had no teeth. Betty has a good diet with plenty of hay and veg and a few pellets.

Does anyone have any advice please, I'm desparate!

Gemma

If your Vet used an electric burr to do Betty's teeth then she may now have what we would recognise as 'sensitive teeth' IE it is uncomfortable to chew as the tooth roots and nerves have been disturbed by the vibration of the burr. Tess had this problem last week and giving her a couple of days on Metacam helped settle the tooth roots/nerves down. She also had an anti GI Ulcer drug, Ranitidine (Zantac) whilst she was not eating much and also on Metacam.
I hope Betty will be eating again soon

Edit: Just thought of something else. Does Betty have a water bottle or bowl? I have found it best to give Buns prone to GI problems a bowl to drink from. They tend to drink much more from a bowl than a bottle and this really helps keep sluggish guts going

Janex

Have you tried massaging her tummy in between meals? It stimulates and mine go into complete relaxation when I do this... Even though they don't have any poblems, it seems to do them good...I can always feel some bubbles inside and massaging makes them go away. Sometimes they have harder places on their belly and when you massage them a bit, they go away...

Jack's-Jane said:

If your Vet used an electric burr to do Betty's teeth then she may now have what we would recognise as 'sensitive teeth' IE it is uncomfortable to chew as the tooth roots and nerves have been disturbed by the vibration of the burr. Tess had this problem last week and giving her a couple of days on Metacam helped settle the tooth roots/nerves down. She also had an anti GI Ulcer drug, Ranitidine (Zantac) whilst she was not eating much and also on Metacam.
I hope Betty will be eating again soon

Edit: Just thought of something else. Does Betty have a water bottle or bowl? I have found it best to give Buns prone to GI problems a bowl to drink from. They tend to drink much more from a bowl than a bottle and this really helps keep sluggish guts going

Janex

Click to expand...

Thanks Jane. Betty has been given Metacam injections and I'm told they last 24 hrs? Anyway, she had one yesterday morning and one in the evening and I presume they'll give her another this evening. I do have oral metacam at home so I'll ask them the dosage for her and will ask for some Ranitidine.

Betty has a bottle but I'll change for a bowl when I get home from work.

I'm really hoping she's eaten something when I do get home...

Clicquot said:

Have you tried massaging her tummy in between meals? It stimulates and mine go into complete relaxation when I do this... Even though they don't have any poblems, it seems to do them good...I can always feel some bubbles inside and massaging makes them go away. Sometimes they have harder places on their belly and when you massage them a bit, they go away...

Click to expand...

Hi Clicquot...I've been massaging her tummy every time I've been giving her the liquid feed. I can hear sounds but no bubbling...my other stasis bunny used to get hard bits in her tummy and loved her rubs. I don't think it does any harm and actually helps us to bond with them. I also try to get Betty moving as this can get their guts shifting again but she only hops a bit then wants to curl up.

I just took a look at the herbs list on our Dutch forum for you.
Herbs that might help with digestions: Camomille, Mint and Papaya.
Its worth a try...

Good Luck and lots of vibes....

AliBenMummy said:

Hi Clicquot...I've been massaging her tummy every time I've been giving her the liquid feed. I can hear sounds but no bubbling...my other stasis bunny used to get hard bits in her tummy and loved her rubs. I don't think it does any harm and actually helps us to bond with them. I also try to get Betty moving as this can get their guts shifting again but she only hops a bit then wants to curl up.

Click to expand...

Have all other sources of pain been excluded? Pain being a cause of GI stasis.
Has she ever had sludgey wee? That can cause cystitis and obviously pain.
How mobile is she normally? Any signs of arthritic pain in her spine?
Did the Vet check her ears and eyes. My Murphy's Uveitis (eye condition) only became apparent when he went into stasis and I was looking for a primary cause. The Uveitis was only noticable when a pentorch was shone in his eye and then all the angry, inflammed blood vessels could be seen.

Has Betty been Panacured? Vets are now saying that EC can effect the GI tract aswell as the CNS, Kidneys etc
Just trying to suggest some possibilities that you could maybe run by your Vet

:?

Janex

Betty is normally very mobile, theres no stopping her - she even jumped out of her run the other day into the garage!

I've not noticed any sludgy wee or anything like that...

I'll ask the vets to check her ears and eyes, shes a REW and scans but I haven't noticed anything amiss. We're seeing a brilliant vet tonight so I'll make sure they do all the tests / checks etc they can to get to the bottom of it.

Panacur was the first treatment we tried when it happened the first time, but she went into stasis again a week later. All three had the Panacur just in case...

I've got some mint in the garden, I'll give it a wash and see if she'll eat some.

I think bunnies know when we're going to leave them, we were supposed to be going away this weekend but I've just cancelled! I can't leave a sick bunny at home.

Poor Betsy Boo...

I just wanted to say I have found Ranitidine (zantac) and its counterpart Cimetidine very helpful with Caspians recurrent stasis, both are PH stabilisers for the treatment of gastric ulceration.....we have had healthy crumbly hay poops for the first time ever since Tuesday

One of our NDs is prone to stasis - or at least very stasis-like symptoms - and she goes through stages of getting pretty frequent attacks of it.

After a few years of trying different diets / drinking bowls etc. we have identified that these attacks occur when she is malting, and that she has continued to get them no matter what we do (regular de-fluffling etc) or her diet (which is predominantly hay).

The more she is maulting - the worse the attacks, and she has just started maulting now for her winter coat.

Martin

Sooz22 said:

I just wanted to say I have found Ranitidine (zantac) and its counterpart Cimetidine very helpful with Caspians recurrent stasis, both are PH stabilisers for the treatment of gastric ulceration.....we have had healthy crumbly hay poops for the first time ever since Tuesday

Click to expand...

I too have found Ranitidine makes a big difference when treating anorexic Buns.
Whats more everyBun I have had to administer it too loves the taste!! :lol:

Janex

Hi there,

We have been to the vets and Betty still hasn't eaten of her own accord. She has been given some more gut stimulant and painkillers and some fluids under the skin. I'm also giving her Fibreplex and still liquid feeding with science recovery.

She seems a bit more feisty today but I'm still at a loss as to why she won't eat. I've bought some mint, basil and all other nice veg so hopefully we'll get her eating soon.

We're going back again tomorrow and if she hasn't picked up by then they're going to hospitalise her. I asked about what could be causing it - they pretty much said the usual - stress, infection, diet etc. She is pooing a tiny bit so theres no blockage or bloat, her tummy is making a small noise but nothing like normal.

The vet said it can sometimes take a few days to kick start them eating again and from experience with Alice I'm not sure - she always had a tiny nibble of something after 24 hours.

I forgot to ask about ranitidine but I'll ask tomorrow when we go again.

Jack's-Jane said:

I too have found Ranitidine makes a big difference when treating anorexic Buns.
Whats more everyBun I have had to administer it too loves the taste!! :lol:

Janex

Click to expand...

Casp isn't too keen on the minty flavour of Zantac but he loves the peach flavour of Cimetidine, I put the syringe through the cage bars and he helps himself :lol:

Sooz22 said:

Casp isn't too keen on the minty flavour of Zantac but he loves the peach flavour of Cimetidine, I put the syringe through the cage bars and he helps himself :lol:

Click to expand...

:lol: :lol:

ABM, I really hope Betty will start eating soon. It can take a few days to get a Buns tum going properly but I feel sure either some Ranitidine (Zantac) or Cimetidine (Tagamet) will help as a Bun can develop GI ulceration after just a day or so of having relatively empty guts.
Please keep us updated, I know how worrying it is when we have a Bun that wont eat yet we cant find out why

Janex

Thanks Jane. Still nothing even so much as nibbled overnight. Betty is getting more and more grumpy with me and is losing patience, I was kicked in the face this morning as I tried to pick her up for her morning feed. In herself she seems quite fiesty but she will not eat a thing. I bought loads of nice smelly herbs last night and all she did was kick the bowl away from her. I've got a hay taster pack from the Hay experts and have tried her with all those but nothing.

The vets may hospitalise her tonight if she still hasn't eaten because they're worried she'll get dehydrated. I've put a bowl of water out for her but haven't seen her drink at all. Its been 48 hours since she ate of her own accord - how long should I wait before I get really really really worried!?

My OH is at home today so he'll be feeding her during the day...I just hope she picks up soon.

AliBenMummy said:

Thanks Jane. Still nothing even so much as nibbled overnight. Betty is getting more and more grumpy with me and is losing patience, I was kicked in the face this morning as I tried to pick her up for her morning feed. In herself she seems quite fiesty but she will not eat a thing. I bought loads of nice smelly herbs last night and all she did was kick the bowl away from her. I've got a hay taster pack from the Hay experts and have tried her with all those but nothing.

The vets may hospitalise her tonight if she still hasn't eaten because they're worried she'll get dehydrated. I've put a bowl of water out for her but haven't seen her drink at all. Its been 48 hours since she ate of her own accord - how long should I wait before I get really really really worried!?

My OH is at home today so he'll be feeding her during the day...I just hope she picks up soon.

Click to expand...

Oks, at this stage I would throw the rule book out the window re what foods to tempt her with. I would try offering a *small* amount of something from this list:
Shredded Wheat Cereal
A piece of very well toasted, almost burnt brown bread
A couple of teaspoonfuls of whole porridge oats soaked in warm water
A small piece of Ryvita (the Multiseed variety seems to be popular)


A shot of Vitamin B12 can stimulate the appetite so you could maybe ask the Vet about this

Janex

i really hope that betty picks up soon. i've been through the same thing just 2 weeks ago with my rex Enya. in the last 10 weeks she has come down with stasis 3 times..no change of diet, teeth fine, eatting enough hay, etc but we moved house 4/5 months ago which the vet surgested may be cause. Enya is now on 2 x 1ml maxolon daily (for the foreseable future) as well as a probiotic which so far seem to working (fingers crossed).
i found that Enya would take licquidised herbs/veg better than either science recovery or baby food (leafy greens ie cabbage, were accepted more readily than items such as carrot). you could also try poking the end of the herb into the mouth (just behind the front teeth) - herbs with a stalk eg pasley, basil etc are good for this -somtimes they will then start chomping, though you may end up feeding bun a bunch of herbs stalk by stalk.

.."A shot of Vitamin B12 can stimulate the appetite so you could maybe ask the Vet about this".....

this worked well for enya. i recal that the vet gave her b12, a second appatite stimulant (sors. bad memory..not sure what i was ..) and maxalon (all via injection) though it made her urinate far more than usual.

Gosh, I'd forgotten about porridge oats. I used to get Alice eating by mixing recovery in with porridge oats mixed in warm water and she loved it. I've got some shredded wheat as well - do I soften it with water or just give her a bit out of the packet?

I'll ask about a B12 injection as well. The poor love is like a pin cushion - she had 75mls of fluids under her skin last night and she coped really well with all the needles. Far better than I would anyway!

I've tried annoying her with herbs and hay and all sorts but she just punches me away.

I do think Bettys problems are stress related because she's otherwise really well and always has been. I would think if its something really bad she'd have gone downhill very quickly. One of my bridge buns, Milo died of liver cancer...he didn't show any symptoms until the day he died.

maxxev said:

Enya is now on 2 x 1ml maxolon daily

Click to expand...

Hi Maxxev - whats Maxolon for please?

If she really hasn't eaten of her own, I agree with Jane, time to get rid of the rules. Anything she eats now is good news. I have something to ad to the nice list that Jane gave you. A friend of mine got this advice from a vet ones with a very old and very sick bun who wouldn't eat anymore either. Boil her some spaghetti... they apparently love it and yo can give it when it is still a bit warm.

Good Luck!!! I hope one of those things gets her eating...