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bonding help needed-sophie attacking!!!

mullethead

Mama Doe
Hiya,
tried to introduce all four buns this morning,and it ended badly!

We followed all the usual,neutral territory etc.
The two new girls were fine and just wanted to sniff and be nosey,but Sophie the doe we have went in for the attack almost straight away and had a go at them both,it wasnt very pleasant and she just didnt want them around atall.
I am not sure if she dosnt want them to go near Bobby (the buck) as she seems to be trying to keep him away from them,we first noticed this when they were in the run outside (I have seperated it into 2 sides with mesh for each pair) and she wouldnt let bobby near the mesh to sniff them and nipped him to keep him away.
I just wanted some advice on what to do next as i dont want to risk a repeat of this morning,which only lasted all of 5 mins before I had to seperate them all again.
Anyone else had this problem?
What happens next? the 2 newies are both spayed,as is bobby,but sophie isnt,should we get her done before introducing them again?
Also Bobby started to hump them both,but wasnt too worried about this as hes a very laid back bun,and maybe this was just due to excitement??
any advice would be appreciated
Thanks Rick
 
I think it would be a good idea to get Sophie neutered before you try bonding again. She seems to be quite a strong personality. But even then she may not want to give up her number one wife place. I have the same problem with my Penny. She has lived with Snoopy for almost a year now, and she wasn't too happy when I added Luna. She has accepted her now, but two weeks ago I added Sunnie, another female, and Penny keeps chasing and nipping her. Sunnie is scared of her and runs away, which doesn't really help.

How bad was the fighting between your bunnies? It is normal to have chasing and fur pulling and some nipping for a while. That's their way to establish a pecking order. It often looks worse than it is, but if there are bleeding ears and other injuries, you have to separate them, of course.
 
Yes I wouldn't advise bonding an unspayed doe in a difficult bond like a foursome unless you have loads of space, time and money for vet bills - the group dynamics are totally different than when bonding a boy/girl pair, which often works fine even when the female's not spayed. Could you keep them just as 2 pairs or isn't that possible with the setup you have?
 
the other thing is, the 2 dutch girls have been through a lot recently and bonding on top of all the stress they've just had could make them ill, so I'd let them settle in for a few weeks anyway :)
 
Hiya,
Thanks for your reply!
sounds like you are in a similar predicament,oh the joys of bonding! lol

Just to clarify,we have had Bobby just past a fortnight,and the bonding process went quite smoothly.
I introduced him to sophie in the kitchen as it was neutral,and she did chase him and nipped a little she also did quite a bit of fur pulling,but nothing that screamed aggression as such,and a couple of hours later she was putting her head down in front of him as if waiting to be groomed,she then groomed him shortly afterwards
it has all been good from there.

It seemed altogether different this morning with the 2 newies,as she lunged at them and jumed onto their back and looked as though she was trying to bite the back of the neck,although I ended it there before any blood could be drawn (my nerves couldnt take anymore!)lol
I am stuck now as to what to do
Thanks Rick
 
yes it's because they're female, and she's unspayed - females are much more territorial than males, and they protect their mate as well as their home - I'm sure Bobby wouldn't care how many girls you brought into his home, but Sophie won't let any through the door :rolleyes:
 
Going to get her done before anything is tried.The newies are in a large hutch at the moment but would like to move them into the playhouse as a 4some with extra large run,i dont mind having two bonded pairs but as a 4some would have more room instead of splitting the space,rick
 
Yes, that sounds quite serious. Is she the boss and stronger than Bobby? I had two pairs of rabbits where the female was the boss and quite a bully, too. But now Snoopy is the boss and Penny adores and grooms him. She just does not want to share him, or at least be the number one among the girls. Luna did not run away from her after a while, just ducked and waited to be groomed. But Sunnie always panics and zooms off. I hope she will get more confident soon. I caught Snoopy grooming her today. Luckily Penny did not see it, she would have been very jealous. :lol:

I would get Sophie spayed and let all bunnies settle down. As Elve said, every change is stressful for them, and bonding adds extra stress and might make them ill. I always try to wait at least for a week before I get a new bunny vaccinated or neutered etc.., and then another one or two weeks before the next "stressful event".
 
So elve if i got her spayed would it make a differance or not,rick:?

It will help calm her down, but she might still be territorial and possessive of her husbun. Penny has been neutered for a year now, and she is usually very friendly. There is no guarantee that the bond will work, but the chances are higher.
 
I dont mind atall having two bonded pairs but thought it would be nice to get them all together as a foursome:cry:

Yes, I know how you feel. I would like mine to get along and be happy, but if Sunnie gets too stressed, I may have to bond her with Luna and have two pairs, as well. But the whole bonding process needs a lot of time. It took 4 weeks until Luna was fully accepted, so I am not giving up yet.
 
I would not let the new girls get stressed but wanted to know how they would get on which i found out:( as soon as sophie lunged in she was off and out as i knew it was too agresive from when i bonded sophie and bobby ii was just the fur pulling,wait to see how she calms if she does with being spayed,rick
 
I would personally go for pairs every time as they are happier in my opinion and less stressed than rabbits in a group - I have a group ready bonded in rescue luckily for me, and they have a larger area than my 2 single bunnies do, but the trade-off is there are always daily scuffles, chasing etc. over food and the hierarchy is always being challenged, which you get a lot less of with a pair, who tend to be closer to each other. In a group you have a clear leader, and the rest of the group respect that, but constantly challenge each other for position of 2nd in command :?

It's also much more problematic monitoring food intake - my 'bottom of the heap' bunny was quite thin last year, so I had to give the group extra food to fatten her up - so now the leaders are a bit porky although the thin one looks good - the leaders snaffle more food, and removing one to feed treats too would lead them to have a bit of a rough reception by their jealous friends when you return them.

I always try to wait at least for a week before I get a new bunny vaccinated or neutered etc.., and then another one or two weeks before the next "stressful event".

That is such a good attitude - I get a bit horrified when I think of the trauma many newly adopted rabbits go through during their first weeks in their new home - just one thing after another and it often leads to permanent ill health from a stressed immune system :(
 
Your girls aren't neutered though are they Elve? Groups which are neutered are probably calmer together. Also, I'd rather get a new bunn vaccinated straight away than risk myxi.

Rick, they may not get on even after Sophie is spayed, but its worth a go.
 
I think it is a bit quick for all bunnies concerned considering you have gone from one bunny to four in the space of two weeks. Getting little Miss hormonal will definately help;) By the fact that your male has humped the dutchies says he wants to be boss so once little miss hormonal has had her ovaries sorted, he might feel more confident to wear the trousers with her too;) :lol: :lol:

I would personally get missy PMT booked in for a spay and leave them all for a few months to get used to their new surroundings and each other before trying to bond:)

Out of interest Elve, why won't you spay your girlies?
 
Your girls aren't neutered though are they Elve? Groups which are neutered are probably calmer together. Also, I'd rather get a new bunn vaccinated straight away than risk myxi.

Rick, they may not get on even after Sophie is spayed, but its worth a go.

I agree about the Myxi jab, with Myxi being so bad this year, it's best to have them vaccinated as soon as possible. I broke my one week rule for Sunnie, too. My other bunnies all had been vaccinated already when I got them from the rescues.
 
Can i just add Topaz and Teasel are mxyi vacs!:D

and agree they should be allowed to settle a bit rick before you try again...your female will be much better speyed and her temp..should calm down afterwards although no guarantee...she also needs to be done to prevent uterine cancer.
I'd say stick to the pairs until you really know all your rabbits..then if you are confident try for a group:D
 
I agree about the Myxi jab, with Myxi being so bad this year, it's best to have them vaccinated as soon as possible. I broke my one week rule for Sunnie, too. My other bunnies all had been vaccinated already when I got them from the rescues.

Can i just add who is talking about myxi jabs,topaz and teasal who came from honeybunny are both myxi jabbed and so are my other two,rick
 
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